Anyone running a 4x10 and 2x10 cab combination?

wdinc01

wdinc01

Nov 19, 2005
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Jacksonville, FL
#1
Just bought a Fender Bassman 500, and I'm looking change up my cabs to match. I'd really like a Bassman 6x10, but that's out of my price range (I'm looking to spend $800 at most). I want to get a punchy sound with tight lows, and I like how fuzz sounds through 10s more than 15s (which is what I currently use).

Does anyone use a 4x10 and 2x10 set up? Would they compliment each other well?
 
#2
IMG_6227.JPG

I've got a GK mbx 410 and an Ashdown abm 210 speaker (formerly attached permanently to the Ashdown amp above it, it was a delicate operation and worth it).
I put ampeg patches on them, because, I'm missing ampeg but not able to afford anything except a $6 patch for each-- plus I know these cabs are mine at a gig, so there's that.
Obviously the brands don't match unless I use them separately. Both amp heads are comparable in volume, albeit GK has that growl. Ashdown's got the VU meter :hyper:
Gigged with the mbx/400rb head and was plenty loud. I connect these together at home and they dust the cobwebs off the ceiling with all the shaking. It's a good setup.
 
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#3
aigman said:
View attachment 1068124
I've got a GK mbx 410 and an Ashdown abm 210 speaker (formerly attached permanently to the Ashdown amp above it, it was a delicate operation and worth it).
I put ampeg patches on them, because, I'm missing ampeg but not able to afford anything except a $6 patch for each-- plus I know these cabs are mine at a gig, so there's that.
Obviously the brands don't match unless I use them separately. Both amp heads are comparable in volume, albeit GK has that growl. Ashdown's got the VU meter :hyper:
Gigged with the mbx/400rb head and was plenty loud. I connect these together at home and they dust the cobwebs off the ceiling with all the shaking. It's a good setup.
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So are you running two different amps, or running one amp into the other?
 
#4
I'm running two different amps separately, depending on my mood for the day, but you can slave up the Ashdown preamp into any amp you want, so sometimes I will just put my bass input into a little guitar amp as well as the Ashdown.
Mostly I just use one cab with one amp though. I don't need two, but they're fun to crank up once in awhile.
 
#5
I think the result depends on how they work with each other. I run an Eden D210XST under a D410XLT. Eden claims they were designed to compliment each other. I think they're right, since the 210 is deep and low while the 410 is loud and growly. They seem to sound awfully good together. And they move a lot of air if you give them enough juice.
 
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#7
BassmanPaul said:
To make a viable 6x10 out of a 4x10 and 2x10 the 2x10 needs to be twice the impedance of the 4x10. This way any one driver in either cabinet receives the same amount of power as any other. Running say two 8Ω cabs, the 2x10 will run out of steam before the 4x10 really gets going.
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So running a 2x10 and a 4x10 stacked would not work as well, or as easily? Is this because there's more speaker surface in the 4x10 as the 2x10? Would the same problem happen with a 4x10 and a 1x15? This is again assuming they're the same brand ( I'm looking at Fender Rumble V3 cabs). I know that different speaker sizes also run into phasing issues, but are there driver issues too?
 
#9
You will face the same problem as wiring them in parallel. As both are 4Ω then they will get the same about of power. Again the 2x10 will be your limiting factor just as with parallel.

Edit: That’s a nice LB76 you have there. My avatar shows me with my LB76WP.
 
#10
BassmanPaul said:
You will face the same problem as wiring them in parallel. As both are 4Ω then they will get the same about of power. Again the 2x10 will be your limiting factor just as with parallel.

Edit: That’s a nice LB76 you have there. My avatar shows me with my LB76WP.
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Both of the cabs I'm looking at are 8Ω, but I see what you're saying. Would I be better off with getting two 4x10s, then? Or is there an external way to increase the impedance of the 2x10?

I'm not familiar with serial boxes. Would that be a simpler solution?
 
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#11
Wiring cabinets in series can help solve some problems with impedance. What has to be taken into consideration is the power distribution. If you have a 4Ω cabinet in parallel with an 8Ω one, the 4Ω will get twice the power of the 8. In parallel it’s completely opposite. in a series chain the higher impedance will “drop”, see more power than the lower one. In our example the 8Ω load will receive twice the power of the 4Ω load.

When it comes to adding cabinets I always advocate identical cabinets. It’s the safest route to follow unless you have a plethora of cabinets you can try together. Even then you could well find that you like identical cabinets yourself. As has been said many times on this site, if you like what your cabinet is doing for you but need more, a second identical cabinet will safely give you more of what you like.

You still have to verify what the minimum impedance is that your amplifier can handle. If it’s 4Ω one 4Ω load is all she wrote.
 
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#13
I think I've concluded I would be fine with just a 4x10 right now, and I'll the money I would use for a second cab I'm going to use to properly put together a pedalboard.

Does anyone have any experience between the Rumble V3 4x10 and the Bassman Pro 4x10?
 
#15
BassmanPaul said:
To make a viable 6x10 out of a 4x10 and 2x10 the 2x10 needs to be twice the impedance of the 4x10. This way any one driver in either cabinet receives the same amount of power as any other. Running say two 8Ω cabs, the 2x10 will run out of steam before the 4x10 really gets going.
Click to expand...
How is this possible? If I have an Ampeg SVT 3Pro 450w@4ohms powering an Ampeg 210HE 8ohms/200w on top of an Ampeg 410HE 8ohm/500w, daisy chain each speaker is getting 75watts. The amp doesn't know I'm running two cabs. It's got 6 speakers to deal with and a 4 ohm load that's all the amp knows.
 

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#16
Rodslinger said:
How is this possible? If I have an Ampeg SVT 3Pro 450w@4ohms powering an Ampeg 210HE 8ohms/200w on top of an Ampeg 410HE 8ohm/500w parallel, daisy chain each speaker is getting 75watts. The amp doesn't know I'm running two cabs. It's got 6 speakers to deal with and a 4 ohm load that's all the amp knows.
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Somebody better at explaining this will chip in I'm sure but I believe it is due to each speaker. The 2x10 would have two 16ohm speakers wired in parallel to create 8ohm whereas the 4x10 could have 4 32ohm speakers wired in parallel to create 8ohms. If the impedance of one cab was 8 and the other 4 this means all 6 speakers would have matching power from the amp.
 
#17
Only way to make this work well would be to power each cab with it's own amp. Line out from the Bassman to a power amp or to another head. That way you can balance the volume of each cab and there won't be an impedance mismatch.
 
#18
Rodslinger said:
How is this possible? If I have an Ampeg SVT 3Pro 450w@4ohms powering an Ampeg 210HE 8ohms/200w on top of an Ampeg 410HE 8ohm/500w parallel, daisy chain each speaker is getting 75watts. The amp doesn't know I'm running two cabs. It's got 6 speakers to deal with and a 4 ohm load that's all the amp knows.
Click to expand...

Sorry but you are wrong.

Using your logic, if you hook up an 8 ohm 1X10 cab along with an 8 ohm 8X10, there would be "no problems" because all the amp sees is a 4 ohm load to spread over 9 speakers.

Try that and let me know what happens.
 
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#19
wdinc01 said:
I think I've concluded I would be fine with just a 4x10 right now, and I'll the money I would use for a second cab I'm going to use to properly put together a pedalboard.
Click to expand...

that makes sense... if you have a half way decent 410, it will cover just about any gig I can imagine. You might even want to consider putting all of the money into a single cab - a better 410 or 212... or two 8 ohm 210s or 112s so you'd have a more modular rig. There are downsides to the side by side 410 design. Dispersion of mids and highs tends to be impacted in a bad way so the bass will sound different in different places. Two 210's in a vertical arrangement works significantly better as do 2 12's in a vertical arrangement. In both of these cases, you also get the top speaker closer to your ear which allows you to hear things better.

For other folk reading the thread though, there are a number of important takeaways... and one that was almost completely passed over.

1. You need to know whether your amp will go below 4 ohms. Many do not and if you go below that, you very well may end up seeing the magic smoke coming from your amp. So, two 8 ohm cabs are fine but a 4 ohm in combination with another will be bad if your head cannot go below 4 ohms.

2. Matching different cabs will likely end up sending the power in unbalanced ways to the individual speakers. That could also be disastrous but even if not, it will likely cause one cab to work harder than it needs to while never pushing the other.

3. Different size drivers or even the same size from different manufacturers may or may not play well together. Ditto cab designs. Two identical cabs are almost always the safest choice and generally the results are better than just adding more of the same.

4. The idea that a 15 will give always you more bottom end and a 10 will always give you more punch is simply not accurate. You need to look at/listen to the individual speaker cab to get an idea what it does.
 
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#20
Bass_Pounder said:
Sorry but you are wrong.

Using your logic, if you hook up an 8 ohm 1X10 cab along with an 8 ohm 8X10, there would be "no problems" because all the amp sees is a 4 ohm load to spread over 9 speakers.

Try that and let me know what happens.
Click to expand...
Please tell me how I'm wrong. I've run my Randall 412xlt 8ohm with a tech 21 B112VT 8ohm on top daisy chain without issue. Seriously, Id love to know why this shouldn't work when it did. But seriously I'd like to know how I've been messing things up because I'd like to stop messing things up if there it validity to all this.
 
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