Double Bass Coming to grips with my limitations

[Ed S]

Apologies - long post ahead.

In short, I'm trying to come to grips with the fact that I'm a pretty decent sideman bassist, but little more.

As a bassist, I was always just "Steady Eddy" - both back when I played slab in rock bands, and since I started playing upright in bluegrass/Americana jams. For a variey of reasons, I wanted to stretch myself. First, I wanted to sing some songs to lead during jams. Then, I started playing in a band, which built up to a 5-piece with regular retirement home gigs. I also started playing in a 4-piece classical ensemble with my wife in my home, and most recently joined a community orchestra. My classical chops are far from great, but I enjoy it and know it is helping me improve.

Our group has settled down to a 3-piece. I picked up clawhammer, and we challenge ourselves with songs and arrangements we like and find interesting, with each of us taking turns singing, working on vocal harmonies, arrangements, etc. Our nursing home gigs dried up with covid, so we now play out rarely. Yesterday was one of those rare gigs and - in short - we weren't that good. 4 bands each played 30 minute sets. We put together 8 songs, and had plenty of time to work on them. But - like I said - we weren't that good. I was quite nervous throughout, we each blew lyrics, transitions, breaks... In between songs was uncomfortable.

I'm probably being harder on myself than I ought, but believe me, we were amateurish and mediocre. Sure, we aren't pros. I just woulda hoped for something more given the time we had to prepare.

Here's the kicker. Our band went on 3d out of 4. When it was time for the first band to go on, their bassist hadn't showed, so the guitarist asked me if I felt spontaneous. I knew - and liked to play with - the guitarist and mando, and knew half the songs in their set, so I said, "Sure!" And I felt more comfortable and played much better during that set than in my band's!

My thoughts after the gig have been very scattered, but I think I've settled down to thinking Clint was right, a man's got to know his limitations!

Happy to discuss if anyone wishes, but no need to write a novel here. Just wanted to get some of that off my chest. And yeah, I know. Take lessons, practice more...

 

[Minimalist]

It sounds like you are taking your own project too serious and get nervous. When you sat in with the 1st band, you had nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Pros do make mistakes, maybe less than non pros, but the main difference is, that they shrug them off and move on. The other thing I noticed with a lot of bands, there is no clear conductor, somebody that calls the shots when things don't go as planned or simply gives clues about the next verse, solo, or the ending.

 

[Tom Lane]

Is there someone in your area whose musicianship and performance you think is better than your groups? and would they be willing to provid e some coaching sessions? Maybe they can help your band get more solid and you'd all enjoy playing together more.

 

[AGCurry]

Ed, your post resonates with me.

Looking back to my self-taught younger days, I was respected for my playing. I had others asking me to give them lessons and tips. Part of my "success" may be attributable to playing with people better than me, but I think it's mostly because I was playing simple music. I could play walking lines, 2/4, and waltzes, all day, and my time and my ear were pretty good in those contexts... small pond, big fish.

By the standards I have today, I was mediocre... and still am.

I'm playing in a near-geriatric "jazz" band, playing arrangements meant for high-school bands. I struggle with reading and agility, mostly, especially in keys like Ab. The other players seem to like me, and I suspect part of that is because nobody listens to the bass.

I just joined a community orchestra, with a bunch of good players, playing challenging stuff. Every rehearsal, I walk in feeling like an imposter, and the other two bassists smile and say "Glad you're here!" My teacher uses the term "bass bodies." Orchestras need bass bodies, I guess.

From both rehearsals I come home. My wife asks me how it went, and my answer is invariably "It's kickin' my *ss, but it's easier than it was."

Two things keep me going. The first is the question "What else would I rather do?" The second is "I'm better than I WAS, and what I'm doing is why that's so." Progress in music IMO needs to be measured over long stretches of time, and the "failures" you describe, while discouraging in the short term, motivate me to work harder.

But yes: Limitations. I'm capable of some magical thinking, imagining doing things I'll never be able to do. But bass bodies are needed, and I can enjoy being one!

 

[Wasnex]

Clint was right, a man's got to know his limitations!

You don't necessarily need to frame it negatively. Many qualities can be both a strength and a weakness, depending on context.

I consider my strength versatility. but it's not always a strength. I am equally at home playing jazz, covers, or classical, however I am not particularly gifted at any of them. I never really expected to have a music career, and yet somehow I stumbled into a career path where my unique mix of talent and skill was useful and valued.

My career was as a military bandsman and my versatility was an advantage; so I was able to excel. Most of my peers were specialists in either classical or jazz. Most of us were expected to play both. My feeling is I was better at classical than most of the jazz specialists. Also I was better at jazz than most of the classical specialists. The result is that I was never one of the better players, but I was also rarely the worst.

There were times where I felt out of place though. I remember doing a gig in Belgium where Toot's Thielman sat in. This was sort of an impromptu thing that we did not coordinate in advance. Luckily I had my Real Book on that particular tour. However since I am more of a faker than an authentic jazz musician, I was a bit anxious performing with someone I perceived as a jazz great. Toot's was gracious and kind. I wouldn't say my performance was inspired, but I don't think it stood out as awful.

I played in a community orchestra for a few years and rehearsals drove me nuts. I eventually decided to quit, but they asked me to continue as a ringer. This included a modest honorarium and I only needed to show up for dress rehearsals. Working at an amateur level still drove me nuts and I quit after doing a few more services.

However, I don't consider myself at the level were I could do section work in a competent professional orchestra. AFAIK good orchestra players tend to specialize in classical, and that is just not my wheelhouse.

The military band program was sort of a sweet spot that allowed me to leverage my natural interests and talents.

 

[WG Plum]

I am a mediocre electric bassist and terrible on upright. Neither fact stops me, for the most part, enjoying the heck out of playing. This wasn't always the case. When I finally stopped caring what other players, or anyone, really, thought, I could finally relax and just have fun. I made peace with my limitations and let it go.

 

[Aaron Rickels]

Back when I was in college and growing milk, I said to my dad, you'll never be free unless you untie your hoods.

 

[Ed S]

Back when I was in college and growing milk, I said to my dad, you'll never be free unless you untie your hoods.

Say WHAT?!

I think the main thing I'm thinking is about how I envision our band. As a 5 piece, we had one strong (and later, 1 weaker) front man. I think I was a lot more comfortable and capable with that dynamic. And the regular low pressure retirement home gigs were a great experience - rapidly ramped me up to a higher level of mediocrity. We briefly tried to gig at bars and restaurants, but one reason we stopped was that it changed the dynamic from just a bunch of friends having fun.

The 3 of us currently enjoy practicing weekly. We like the music we are playing, and know we are gradually improving. But none of us is taking the lead to revive the retirement home circuit and - more importantly - none of us is a strong frontman. So we've got 3 (decent, not great) sidemen trying to be a complete group.

I think I'm just getting comfortable with the idea that gigging isn't going to be a big part of my music future.

I uess I gots to untie my hoods, no?

 

[Holdsg]

A gig is a gig, and we are all our own harshest critics.
When it stops being fun, it's time to shake it up a bit.
Maybe take a break for a few months. Focus on a different instrument, or a different genre, anything to get some inspiration flowing.
And if that doesn't work. Well, maybe it's time to travel or do other things with your spare time. Only you can decide that.

 

[J Wilson]

We all grow up thinking we SHOULD be this or that. I grew up on bass in the 70's and 80's, when figures like Jaco or Stanley or Geddy or Squire or Entwistle were writing new chapters in The Book.

But I grew up on Carol Kaye and Joe Osborne and David Hood, solid players with that little something, yet not the Olympians of the Bass. I had a friend was a total Rush freak, learned so many Geddy lines note for note, and would laugh at me when I said I only wanted to play as well as McCartney.

So that was my wheelhouse, with a nagging fear I wasn't 'good enough' or 'hip enough' or any of the other enoughs. Which was utterly pointless.

So I was really good at the cats I admired, and as I couldn't drink, I got lots of gigs when the guy they had . . . . finally picked the time that DID get him fired to slop through a gig or not even show up. I made a fortune 'riding to the rescue', and often only on a few hours' notice. So I had to have fast ears, keep the radar cranked up, and watch them like a hawk, and you know what? It usually worked great, I completely forgot about worrying about walking into a gig with no rehearsal, and was good for me.

I never did learn 'ByrdLand' or 'School Days' or the first side of '2112', but then, there were no gigs that paid to play those anyway. 'Cinnamon Girl' in D?

Count it off !

 

[Mr Horse]

Back when I was in college and growing milk, I said to my dad, you'll never be free unless you untie your hoods.

Truly

 

[micguy]

I think you have it wrong. I'll explain.

I play church gigs - I run into very different scenarios when I go to different places. When I'm at a place where there a lots of great instrumentalists on stage, along with a slew of great singers, despite the fact that the implied standards are higher, it's a joy, and it's easy to play well - there is a whole network around you, a fabric of great music, and everyone is shouldering a tiny bit of the load. It's easy to play well, and feel great about it.

Some weekends, there is a keys player, a drummer, me, and a couple vocalists, and nobody is all that great. I am every bit as good of a musician, but in that context, I shoulder a much higher amount of the load, and..despite the fact that the implied standards are lower, it's tough. I take those gigs, in part because I am serving (which I'm called to do), but also because it makes me a better player. But...not all of my gigs are tough ones.

You played with two bands in one night. One was easy/good, one was tough/not so good. Assuming I have this right, You aren't the weakest link in your band - you're probably better than you're giving yourself credit for.

So now, the real question: A band that's better than yours just auditioned you. Not sure if that occurred to you, but ponder this for a bit: Their bass player didn't show (which is a huge no no); they are very likely in the market for a replacement, you jumped in cold, and the set went well. So...when they call you, what are you going to say?

I'm not kidding - you're a bass player, apparently a decent one. I've played a dozen churches in the last decade. I auditioned at two - that's what happens to us. Opportunities tend to just show up for good bass players. Think about it, be ready with your answer.

I suggest yes.

 

[Bass Motifs]

I suspect most musicians introspect and "fret" like this (sorry, trolling the DB forum).

I'm trying to change my focus from being a "good musician" to making "good music". We can all work within our limitations to do that. Who knows, sounds like when you stay in your lane you come across as a capable and tasteful player!!! Keeping it classy

 

[Groove Doctor]

When I finally stopped caring what other players, or anyone, really, thought, I could finally relax and just have fun. I made peace with my limitations and let it go.

Sage advice.

 

[smo]

One of the more fun games to play with bandmates is spontaneity.

I have a lifelong mate who likes to introduce new songs, whether original or covers, without telling us what it is, or where it's going.
So we go in blind, not knowing the chords or structure until (or if) someone can guess the song.

It's a lot of fun. I think there's occasions where we find some real mojo.
Doing it live on stage would be a bit of a leap I imagine.

 

[Geogio]

Learn to read, work on Bach for bass, play along with recordings, improvise. Drill, neck exercises. Jam, keep it simple, strip it down, don't play too busy.

Playbacks are humbling, the divas use too much vibrato, EVERBODY overplays. The soundboard team are usually far from adequate, learn the sound board. It's CCM, it's very limited musically... it's pop music.

Old hymns by masterful composers or copied from said masterful composers are wonderfully diverse. Stodgy perhaps but there are golden nuggets in there.

Everything Bach wrote was for the church! Throwing around Bach phrases in a CCM pop song format does wonders.

Take some rudimental drum lessons, master the drum pad. Learn hand percussion, tambourine, clave, learn understatement.

Transform yourself into a percussionist with a string to pluck. Forget the slap and pop. Driving the rhythm is often subtle but omnipresent. Play with authority. Own it!

A lot of bassists cannot drum with their fingers let alone turn their instrument into a rhythmic and tonal underpinning of the rhythm section.

Work with the drummer... I repeat work with the drummer!

Find a revival band! Shout choruses for 45 minutes gets the sweat rollin'... you can actually smell the perspiration in the air! It's alive! It pulsates, and moves!

Save the convalescent homes for the buskers. A banjoist with a harmonica can get them folks singing nursery rhymes at the drop of a hat! Revivals and tent meetins' need inspiration too! Go for it!

 

[turf3]

Some of how well you're playing depends on the people you're playing with. If I am playing bass with a group where the other musicians are responsive, listen to what's happening around them, my own playing sounds a whole lot better than if I'm the only one that has a sense of time and I have to drag them along, hold them back, and constantly adapt to people who go to the next chord at the wrong time.

OP, something that isn't clear in your tale - were you playing clawhammer banjo in your own group and playing bass on the group where you guested? Two different instruments would certainly be part of the explanation of different experiences.

 

[Ed S]

Upright for the "guest" slot, upright and clawhammer for my band.

Perhaps the best thing about our band is that we do all listen to each other, and emphasize doing what is best for the overall sound. We regularly pull out a metronome if we feel the need. Our efforts just don't seem to translate to performance.

 

[WG Plum]

Back when I was in college and growing milk, I said to my dad, you'll never be free unless you untie your hoods.

I have no idea what it means, but I approve this message.

 

[J Wilson]

I finally made peace with not being the next NAMM Olympian, and decided I didn't play a LOT of notes, but I played BIG notes.

Worked out fine.