considerations about truss rod when adding carbon fiber stiffeners to a neck

David Walden

David Walden

Nov 24, 2013
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#1
Hello, I am not a luthier and am wanting to make life easier for me and my luthier. I want to eliminate the dead spot that the neck is plagued with on the G string of my '05 MIM Fretless Jazz bass. While I'm at it I want to have him add frets.
My luthier, Dave Gilstrap in Broken Arrow, OK suggested that I laminate the neck to eliminate the dead spot. He suggested that we use some of the mahogany he has on hand and I was fine with that until it occurred to me that carbon fiber might be lighter. I'm considering adding two 0.200" x 1/4" x 24" length Item # 4404 carbon fiber neck rods. After reading Luthiers’ Round Table Spring Spring 2015 issue I am wondering if the neck will be so stiff that the Thomastik Infeld Jazz flatwounds that I use will not provide enough relief. So, my question is: should I invest also in a two-way truss rod? Thanks
 
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#4
David Walden said:
<<snip>> Luthiers’ Round Table Spring Spring 2015 <<snip>>
Click to expand...

David thanks for posting this doc

I quickly read through the article, and found it interesting that discussion on grain orientation, stiffeners and larger head stocks, to some extent went to address dead spots. It also sounds like most of these guys are using maple for their neck material.

Why not use a wood heavier than maple? Wouldn't that fix the problem?
 
#6
Scoops said:
David thanks for posting this doc

I quickly read through the article, and found it interesting that discussion on grain orientation, stiffeners and larger head stocks, to some extent went to address dead spots. It also sounds like most of these guys are using maple for their neck material.

Why not use a wood heavier than maple? Wouldn't that fix the problem?
Click to expand...

It might, Scoops. I don't want to build a new neck from scratch. I'd just like the neck I've got to *not* get much heavier, to ring like a bell (or at least not thump like a melon so much) on that spot. I've already tried a Fender Fat Finger on it and tested it in different spots on the headstock. I found the sweet spot for placement but it never eliminated the dead spot.
 
#8
I've changed to lighter tuners and/or different strings and it moved the 'dead spot' (resonant point) off a fret to somewhere between them, and that pretty much eliminates it. Wouldn't work with fretless, tho, but my limited fretless experience hasn't shown any 'dead spots'.
 
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#9
My luthier said in order to change the truss rod we'd need to remove the fingerboard. At that point we might as well build a new neck.
I see that Fender now offers graphite reinforced necks for ~ $500. Warmoth has some nice necks too. I might just go with one of those options.
 
#17
I'm building a Ric 4001 clone and used two carbon stiffener rods and a DA trussrod, hoping I don't end up with a neck that's TOO rigid. The only downside I can see to DA rods is that they seem to require a slightly deeper channel, which limits how thin you can shave the neck.
 
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#18
A lot of bother and expense that would be most cost effectively solved with a replacement neck, as stated above.
Just the fact that you have a traditional compression truss rod in a curved channel neck / skunk stripe means not only removing the fretboard to route two channels for the graphite rods, but also correcting the curved channel to get a dual action trussrod to function correctly (they require a flat channel). Which, byy way of laminating a donor strip of wood into the channel would potentially make it even stiffer, as you fear, if it doesn't just pop the skunk stripe out the back. Then fretting it? Forget about it.

You could get a Warmoth neck with the graphite rods for @ 250 bucks, and give it a finish with re ranch rattle can for 15 bucks. And it'd be exceptional quality, comparatively
You would only be getting though JUST the decent slot and fret job for the same money.
 
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#19
Excellent feedback! Thank you one and all. Based upon your input, I'm thinking of getting a Warmoth slim-taper maple neck with Indian Rosewood fretboard, Graphite rods, 20 SS6130 frets and no mounting holes (I'll drill my own and set brass wood inserts for the 8-32 machine screws). $410 plus freight. Your thoughts?

Here are some pics of the transition of this bass so far:
Microsoft OneDrive - Access files anywhere. Create docs with free Office Online.
 
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#20
Good decision, the Warmouth necks are extremely well made, very nice fretwork too. Rumor has it they are heavy though, may result in neck dive if that's not already a problem. I built a fretless Jazz from an ash Warmouth Jazz body and rock maple Jazz neck with ebony FB, and its a wee bit neck heavy. I wish I knew a good way to figure this out ahead of assembly without involving the word "centroids". I suppose you could always get a heavier high-mass bridge if it's a problem. Cool build, BTW.
 
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