Hot Pickup+Tube Combo=Nasty Squealing. Please help!

Riff Ranger

bass/guitar/vocals in Thunderhorn
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Mar 22, 2018
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EDIT: TL;DR: At least one preamp tube had gone microphonic. Replacing the preamp tubes solved the problem. The pickup hadn't been adjusted perfectly when installed but it's fine now.

I really hope this bass and this amplifier can play nicely together.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/uzTfF4wKNCxPqk5PA

That's a Lace Aluma-P (apparently extremely) high output passive pickup and a Mesa Buster! 200 1x15 all-tube combo. I recently acquired both in hopes of achieving responsive grit and drive without a huge rig (surprise, surprise, I play metal; I'm after something like budget versions of Jeff Matz's tones here). I love the bass, the pickup, and the amp, but the kind of digging in that brings out that grit and drive tends to set off some nasty squealing—ear-splitting, can't-play-through-or-over, hit-standby-this-instant squealing. I can turn down a bit, switch back on several seconds later, and play normally, but if possible I'd like to be able to dig in without worrying about this.

Before I try to swap out anything or cough up a bench fee, I'm hoping a few of you will be kind enough to offer your wisdom on the matter. Specifically:

  • What's going on? My best guess from what I've read so far is that the tubes are getting jostled too much and what I'm hearing is an extreme case of tube microphonics, but I'm fairly ignorant about electronics generally and entirely new to tube amplifiers.
  • What are my options for addressing this? Switching from steel strings back to nickel has helped (good, because I've long preferred nickel anyway), but hasn't solved the issue entirely. I bought the Aluma-P because I anticipated this bass arriving with a ho-hum, run-of-the-mill stock pickup, but the stock pickup actually wasn't half bad and I've kept it, so I could go back to that if I had to (this bass-pickup combo also just killed a Blackstar FLY right out of the box, though that might have been a defective amp). EDIT: FLY's fine. No idea why I thought it wasn't other than that my Thunderbird seems to have much lower output than my other basses.
  • Would adding an Xotic RC Bass Booster or similar pedal help or hurt, given the driven tone I'm after?
Hopefully helpful information:
  • My other basses (passive Thunderbird, active 5-string [detuned to G!]) don't seem to produce this result. The seller and I also played a number of his basses (active and passive, hot and not) through the amp before I bought it. EDIT: As it turns out, I get the awful squealing if I push it with any of these basses.
  • This bass plays seems to play nicely with the new Fender Rumble 1x15s at my favorite store, and drives my little solid state Orange 35b beautifully.
  • The problem seems to occur with the gain (called "volume" on this amp, but "gain" on pretty much any other) past 2:30 and the master past 9:30. The manual suggests that the amp starts to distort with the gain past 3:00, but not that this range is unusable. It's pretty much impossible to play with a drummer with the gain anywhere left of 1:00, anyway.
  • I've got the lows at 11:00, mids at 1:00, and highs at 11:00, graphic disengaged.
  • No effects at the moment, just plugged directly into the amp, with a patch cable in the effects loop (problem occurred with and without a cable in the effects loop).
  • Amp sits directly on a not-perfectly-level concrete slab in a sealed garage.
Thank you for any insight you can provide.
 
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1. Does your position relative to amp change the squeal?

2. Does turning the bass' volume control to zero stop the squeal?

- John
I'd have to trigger the squeal <wince> to be sure, because it's so bad I try to make it go away as quickly as possible, but:

1. I don't think so.
2. Not sure if I actually tried that, but I think I did, and I think it didn't change anything. I could be making that up, haha/groan.
 
Warm up your amp and take a non conducting rod like a pencil or wooden dowel and tap each tube. If one (or more) is microphonic you'll hear it and you'll know which needs replacing. Preamp tubes can be changed with no worries. Power amp tubes will need to be re-biased (by a tech if you don't know how) if they need replacement. Preamp tubes are relatively inexpensive. Power amp tubes may or may not be depending on what they are.
 
Warm up your amp and take a non conducting rod like a pencil or wooden dowel and tap each tube. If one (or more) is microphonic you'll hear it and you'll know which needs replacing. Preamp tubes can be changed with no worries. Power amp tubes will need to be re-biased (by a tech if you don't know how) if they need replacement. Preamp tubes are relatively inexpensive. Power amp tubes may or may not be depending on what they are.

I'll have to get some sleep before I can figure out how to get to my preamp tubes (looks like I have to undo some cables and remove some screws), but tapping on the power tubes produced no obvious sounds through the speaker. Stay tuned about the preamp tubes. If it turns out to be a tube or tubes acting up, could I replace it/them and then dig in without fear?
 
From what you described it sounds to me like the p/up.

Agreed, or else the same issue would be had with other basses if it were a tube.

I don't think it has anything to do with the "hotness" of the pup though, more likely there's a loose winding that's gone microphonic and is transmitting sympathetic vibrations as the squeel.

Probably should take the bass to a respectable tech.
 
Who installed the p/up ?
An experienced tech at a big independent guitar store. The bass side of the split seemed weird when I first got it back, though: angled up sharply toward the third string. It actually popped out and stuck to the string at one point! Basses aren't supposed to go "goink!" haha/groan. I then screwed it down to a height and angle more or less mirroring the treble side, tweaking it so the output of each string was more or less equal.
 
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Agreed, or else the same issue would be had with other basses if it were a tube.

I don't think it has anything to do with the "hotness" of the pup though, more likely there's a loose winding that's gone microphonic and is transmitting sympathetic vibrations as the squeel.

Probably should take the bass to a respectable tech.
The guy who installed it has worked for years at a shop a friend had recommended to me, but maybe I should have somebody else look at it; I wasn't thrilled with the weird angle on the bass side, which I ended up adjusting myself (see above).
 
An experienced tech at a big independent guitar store. The bass side of the split seemed weird when I first got it back, though: angled up sharply toward the third string. It actually popped out and stuck to the string at one point! Basses aren't supposed to go "goink!" haha/groan. I then screwed it down to a height and angle more or less mirroring the treble side, tweaking it so the output of each string was more or less equal.

Well, it's possible the bobbin has separated from the base plate if it popped up like that.

I'm not familiar with that pick up so I'm just guessing. Someone who knows what they're looking at is going to have to determine what's going on.
 
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If it turns out to be a tube or tubes acting up, could I replace it/them and then dig in without fear?
I'm not familiar with the Buster but the manual you linked to has a section on Tube Maintenance. It seems to cover most or all of the info you'll need. Be aware that there's a lot of voltage stored in an amp even when it's off or unplugged. Be careful what you touch. As for digging in without fear, if the problem is a tube, and you replace it, then sure. If that's not the problem then???
 
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Well, it's possible the bobbin has separated from the base plate if it popped up like that.

I'm not familiar with that pick up so I'm just guessing. Someone who knows what they're looking at is going to have to determine what's going on.
I'll have the guy who installed it take one more look before I pay somebody else to get it right, haha/groan again.
 
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I'm not familiar with the Buster but the manual you linked to has a section on Tube Maintenance. It seems to cover most or all of the info you'll need. Be aware that there's a lot of voltage stored in an amp even when it's off or unplugged. Be careful what you touch. As for digging in without fear, if the problem is a tube, and you replace it, then sure. If that's not the problem then???
From what others are saying on the thread, it sounds like the most likely culprit here is the installation of the pickup. I'd still like to get under the hood of this amp, but I might have somebody with a clue there so I don't electrocute myself, haha.
 
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I can't say without seeing it but from what he added quoting your question, the pickup is either defective or the installation is botched.
Sounds like I might need a second set of experienced eyes to look into the pickup installation. And also like I need to crank up and dig in with my other basses tomorrow, bwahaha!