Neck shim causing high action and buzz att higher frets on my L2000?

Dade8283

Dade8283

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Feb 24, 2016
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#1
Hello!

I have a G&L Tribute L 2000 that I've been struggling to get a good setup on. I now have it setup so that I get minimal buzz when digging in but it's way higher than I'm used to. Action is way over 3 mm at 17th fret and the relief is about 0.3 mm. The factory specs call for around 0.12"-0.14" relief at 8th fret and a action of 3/32" at 17th. I'm way over that...

If I lower the action more to spec I get an ok amount of buzz att the lower frets but way to much buzz from 9/10th fret and higher. It's across all the strings but low E string (dropped to D) is worst and choking when not played REALLY light.

I've noticed that there's a small shim att the neck joint (bridge side) made from a thin strip of sandpaper (Probably from factory). My understanding is that you only shim a neck like that if the bridge saddles are bottoming out and you can't get the action any lower. My problem is quite the reversed, so why is there a shim there?

Is there a chance that this shim might be the reason for my high action and the fret buzz att the higher frets?

I play in drop D with a 45-105 Guage of Elixir nickel string and I do play rather hard with a pick. A decent amount of buzz is allright acoustically but not like this.

Any other tips that might help me to get a lower action? Increasing relief?
 
#2
I had a similar problem with my G&L ASAT & when I took it to the local guitar guru he said the frets were perfect (Pleked).

Check the frets for flat spots, which might need re-crowning.

or just take it to your local guitar guru for a diagnosis

You're right, the shim is there to keep the saddles from bottoming out, so if you remove it your action will be even higher, unless your saddles are currently jacked up pretty high.

0.045" - 0.105" is actually the string diameters in inches.

AWG (gauge) is different, where a larger number equals a smaller diameter.
 
#4
Killed_by_Death said:
I had a similar problem with my G&L ASAT & when I took it to the local guitar guru he said the frets were perfect (Pleked).

Check the frets for flat spots, which might need re-crowning.

or just take it to your local guitar guru for a diagnosis

You're right, the shim is there to keep the saddles from bottoming out, so if you remove it your action will be even higher, unless your saddles are currently jacked up pretty high.

0.045" - 0.105" is actually the string diameters in inches.

AWG (gauge) is different, where a larger number equals a smaller diameter.
Click to expand...
How did you solve your problem? Did you have it pleked?

The bridge saddles are up pretty high now and I doubt they'll be bottoming out if I remove the shim. I was more wondering if removing the shim would change the angle and thereby enable for a lower action without buzz att the higher frets?
 
#7
Dade8283 said:
How did you solve your problem? Did you have it pleked?
Click to expand...

Mine was a limited edition U.S. model & came Pleked from the factory.
I just played lighter on it for a year & finally sold it, because it also had some pretty awful neck dive.
Little did I know at the time, but I had a very light G&L, semi-hollow body (but w/o the F holes). That probably helped with the neck dive, but I'll never buy another Telecaster shaped bass.


Dade8283 said:
The bridge saddles are up pretty high now and I doubt they'll be bottoming out if I remove the shim. I was more wondering if removing the shim would change the angle and thereby enable for a lower action without buzz att the higher frets?
Click to expand...

I don't think it will solve that problem, but if you can take the shim out, I would.
Yes, it will definitely change the angle of the neck.
 
#11
/\/\3phist0 said:
BassesByLeo • Vieic - G&L Bass Setup Procedures
Nice subsection by paul gagon:
BassesByLeo • View forum - Paul's Technicalities

super guide :) http://www.jerzydrozdbasses.com/akcndfr54jdhrei567/Ultimate_Guide_ver100.pdf
Click to expand...
Thanks! I've actually read those (from there I got my factory specs). That super setup guide is good. In there he mentions that neck relief should be between 0.3 - 1 mm and that using 0.3 mm relief will mean that you Have to compensate with Higher action. For lower action he recommends More relief. could someone please confirm this?

Maybe I just need More relief?

Also, should I be doing All my measurements while having the bass laying on a desk or while in playing position? I use the latter and know that gravity will have an effect.
 
#14
Turnaround said:
Perhaps a tad too little, but your problem will more likely be the string height at the bridge.
Click to expand...
I might try to increase the relief a bit to .014" instead of .012". I don´t have any buzz right know but I find the action too high at the bridge and would like lower it down a bit more towards factory spec. Increased neck relief should theoretically make it possible to lower the action at the bridge, right?

Any clue on why the neck seems to be factory shimmed (without any obvious reasons? Should I try to remove it?
 
#15
Dade8283 said:
Increased neck relief should theoretically make it possible to lower the action at the bridge, right?

Any clue on why the neck seems to be factory shimmed (without any obvious reasons? Should I try to remove it?
Click to expand...
Adding relief will only allow you to lower the action if the buzzing is only occurring on the first three to five frets. And even then adding relief may not let you get the string height any lower. You can try it - it's easy enough to do.

The main reason for shimming a neck is because you can't get the string height low enough because the saddles are bottomed out. It also changes the relationship of the string path to the top of the body and the pickups, so maybe those were considerations in your case. Take out the shim and see if the decreased string-to-body clearance has any negative effect on the string-to-body or the string-to-pickup clearances. It's easy to do and reversible if you discover a problem.
 
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#16
Turnaround said:
Adding relief will only allow you to lower the action if the buzzing is only occurring on the first three to five frets. And even then adding relief may not let you get the string height any lower. You can try it - it's easy enough to do.

The main reason for shimming a neck is because you can't get the string height low enough because the saddles are bottomed out. It also changes the relationship of the string path to the top of the body and the pickups, so maybe those were considerations in your case. Take out the shim and see if the decreased string-to-body clearance has any negative effect on the string-to-body or the string-to-pickup clearances. It's easy to do and reversible if you discover a problem.
Click to expand...

I always thought that the truss rod and neck relief had an effect up to around the 12th fret? Soo if I get buzz around 9-12th fret, it's not the relief?
 
#17
Dade8283 said:
I always thought that the truss rod and neck relief had an effect up to around the 12th fret? Soo if I get buzz around 9-12th fret, it's not the relief?
Click to expand...
It's a combination of both relief and saddle height that controls the geometry of fret buzz. From the 5th fret toward the nut is the domain of relief. Above there it's the domain of saddle height.
The truss rod controls the curve of the neck from the nut up to about the 12th fret, but above the 5th fret relief has less and less effect in managing clearance over the frets while saddle height has more and more effect.
 
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#18
Turnaround said:
It's a combination of both relief and saddle height that controls the geometry of fret buzz. From the 5th fret toward the nut is the domain of relief. Above there it's the domain of saddle height.
The truss rod controls the curve of the neck from the nut up to about the 12th fret, but above the 5th fret relief has less and less effect in managing clearance over the frets while saddle height has more and more effect.
Click to expand...
Also as it relates to the plane created by nut height.
 
#19
Turnaround said:
It's a combination of both relief and saddle height that controls the geometry of fret buzz. From the 5th fret toward the nut is the domain of relief. Above there it's the domain of saddle height.
The truss rod controls the curve of the neck from the nut up to about the 12th fret, but above the 5th fret relief has less and less effect in managing clearance over the frets while saddle height has more and more effect.
Click to expand...
Hm.. Ok I think I'm getting it.

I'm also starting to think that I might be picking way to hard. I usually tend to get less Buzz when playing with my fingers (even when I dig in a bit). Soo there is that to consider. I do however really like the growly sound you get when really digging in with rounds. I don't mind a bit of buzz. Maybe I have to work a bit more on my technique when picking... Maybe thicker strings (higher tension) might give less buzz?
 
#20
this illustrates:
Guitar-Necksmaller_zps85fe8e9e.gif
 
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