Passive PBass 5-String Tone Control Circuit

bassplayer2014

bassplayer2014

Inactive
Jun 7, 2014
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Arizona
#1
Some advice/recommendations please?

I have a 2012, passive, Fender, American Standard, 5-String, Precision Bass. All stock with Ernie Ball Cobalt Flats using a .130 B string. To me, this bass plays very well and I'm looking for a more hifi/piano like sound. Before I spend $150.00 or more on Delano, Rio Grande, Aguilar, Lindy Fralin, Nordstrand or Bartolini pickups I think a higher quality passive tone circuit/potentiometer may be prudent. I'm a huge Bartolini fan and I'm leaning towards Delano pickups.

I read alot of posts about replacing the tone potentiometer. I read some have 12 or more capacitors with various au measurements and notched dial. Some has Bass & trebble in tandem. Some have a passive circuit board. Some require wood routing.

Has anyone changed a passive tone circuit/potentiometer and experienced good results? What did you use? How big of a tone difference was produced? Advantages vs disadvantages? Can you recommend some products?

Thanks in advance for your comments.
 
#8
Rotosound has some strings that are meant to sound piano like psd Roto 99s I think.

I also like a piano like sound on my squier vmp5 and haven't switched pups yet. I get close with coders strings as well. The steel set might be up your ally.

As far as cap values the .033 might really serve you well I went yhebother way on another bass and added a .1 and it's a crazy difference.

Side note, how long ave you had the cobalt flats on and how does their sound evolve over time? I'm very interested in these strings.
 
#10
Dogbertday, I do like the Rotosound strings. If I enjoyed the sound of my Fender AS P5 my EB Cobalt Flats are probably really great string. I've had the EB Cobalt Flats on for about a month. How did the .1 tone pot work out? What was/is the crazy difference?
Gougedeye said:
How about a Stellartone?
Stellartone - <B><I>DO NOT MOVE THIS PAGE 337! VIDEOS 1-6</I></B>
Click to expand...
Less harsh highs? Smoother tone transition?

When I bought this bass I was very impressed with the fit, quality control, playability, finish and the like. The stock pickups, I'm sure they're functional as Fender intends them to be and I just feel they sound under-articulated, muddy and not overly defined.

I'm most probably a bit jaded because with the exception of my Fender AS P5, all five of my bass's have either Bartolini or Nordstrand pickups installed.

Gougedeye, thanks for the link. I'll look into this StellerTone/ToneStyler tonight. This StellerTone/ToneStyler, or a similar 6 - 12 capacitor tone pot, may be exactly what I'm looking for? Have you any first hand experience with this StellerTone/ToneStyler?
 
#11
My .1 cap went the opposite direction you're looking to go. When I roll THAT tone knob off it cuts more highs than the stock .048 cap. To my ears my .1 gives me more boom and less burp when rolling off highs. The .033 I believe is standard in many fender guitars and it's possible it would go the other way and open up your sound significantly. Bypassing the tone pot all together may also be your anser as all tone pots affect the highs a bit whether rolled off or not.

I'd be willing to trade my used fodera nickel strings for your used cobalt flats if you'd like to try them out.
 
#14
bassplayer2014 said:
Some advice/recommendations please?

I have a 2012, passive, Fender, American Standard, 5-String, Precision Bass. All stock with Ernie Ball Cobalt Flats using a .130 B string. To me, this bass plays very well and I'm looking for a more hifi/piano like sound. Before I spend $150.00 or more on Delano, Rio Grande, Aguilar, Lindy Fralin, Nordstrand or Bartolini pickups I think a higher quality passive tone circuit/potentiometer may be prudent. I'm a huge Bartolini fan and I'm leaning towards Delano pickups.

I read alot of posts about replacing the tone potentiometer. I read some have 12 or more capacitors with various au measurements and notched dial. Some has Bass & trebble in tandem. Some have a passive circuit board. Some require wood routing.

Has anyone changed a passive tone circuit/potentiometer and experienced good results? What did you use? How big of a tone difference was produced? Advantages vs disadvantages? Can you recommend some products?

Thanks in advance for your comments.
Click to expand...

I just put a new passive harness in my project bass, and I've done it several other times. I prefer passive electronics.

You might like a Varitone for what you're wanting there. That and maybe a 500k volume pot.

One setting on a varitone is normally a bypass so there will be a slight boost to the high-end. It's like having no tone knob in the circuit. Long story short, when you add a tone pot to the circuit even on 10 it's still interacting with the other components and changing your sound.

Varitones are usually wired so that switching to something other than bypassed is like having a tone pot rolled all the way off. The nice thing though is you can use lower valued capacitors for less treble cut than you might think. These also introduce a resonant peak that is different depending on the cap. It sort of helps dial in what higher-end frequency you want boosted but also cuts treble at the same time.

Here's an example of how a varitone can change the frequencies present in your sound (each colored line is a different switch setting basically) :

VaryCToneControlPlot.png


Here's an example of what a normal tone pot does instead (the bold character is the position, e.g. 10 on the pot) :

ToneControlGraph.jpg


And here's a video comparing a Varitone with a regular tone Pot on a P-bass :



The varitone harness I got for my project bass has six settings :

1. Bypass (most treble)
2. 0.01 uF (slight cut, sort of honky)
3. 0.022 uF (warm sound, not too muddy yet)
4. 0.047 uF (basically like a normal tone pot rolled all the way off, I don't like it personally)
5. Mid Scoop
6. Deep Scoop (Sounds like a neck mudbucker but has a hair of high end for clarity)

It also has treble-bleed on the volume pot, which behaves kind of like a bass-cut for about 1/8 - 1/4 of a turn. It's actually really useful for dialing down your bass frequencies a hair. For me it makes the volume knob actually useful, otherwise I could get by with a kill switch.

I got the varitone harness from Kellingsound on Ebay. He makes AMAZING stuff. Check him out. Here's one wired for urban contemporary and hip-hop (he says it should work well with a 5 stringer) : Fender P Bass Harness 6 Way Varitone Low End Settings Kellingsound | eBay. Otherwise look at his other auctions, he has other harnesses or standalone varitones you can put in your bass. He can also make custom stuff.

I have no affiliation with him, I just like his products and have used a few of them. He deserves more attention since his stuff is really creative yet still done tastefully.

One other avenue is to get a MFD P pickup from G&L. That's the most piano-like/hifi Precision pickup I've ever found.
 
Last edited:
#15
Dogbertday said:
My .1 cap went the opposite direction you're looking to go. When I roll THAT tone knob off it cuts more highs than the stock .048 cap. To my ears my .1 gives me more boom and less burp when rolling off highs. The .033 I believe is standard in many fender guitars and it's possible it would go the other way and open up your sound significantly. Bypassing the tone pot all together may also be your anser as all tone pots affect the highs a bit whether rolled off or not.

I'd be willing to trade my used fodera nickel strings for your used cobalt flats if you'd like to try them out.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your suggestions. I very much appreciate your trade offer and I'm not a used string kind of bassist. Thanks anyway
 
#16
Antisyzygy said:
I just put a new passive harness in my project bass, and I've done it several other times. I prefer passive electronics.

You might like a Varitone for what you're wanting there. That and maybe a 500k volume pot.

One setting on a varitone is normally a bypass so there will be a slight boost to the high-end. It's like having no tone knob in the circuit. Long story short, when you add a tone pot to the circuit even on 10 it's still interacting with the other components and changing your sound.

Varitones are usually wired so that switching to something other than bypassed is like having a tone pot rolled all the way off. The nice thing though is you can use lower valued capacitors for less treble cut than you might think. These also introduce a resonant peak that is different depending on the cap. It sort of helps dial in what higher-end frequency you want boosted but also cuts treble at the same time.

Here's an example of how a varitone can change the frequencies present in your sound (each colored line is a different switch setting basically) :

View attachment 713960

Here's an example of what a normal tone pot does instead (the bold character is the position, e.g. 10 on the pot) :

View attachment 713956

And here's a video comparing a Varitone with a regular tone Pot on a P-bass :



The varitone harness I got for my project bass has six settings :

1. Bypass (most treble)
2. 0.01 uF (slight cut, sort of honky)
3. 0.022 uF (warm sound, not too muddy yet)
4. 0.047 uF (basically like a normal tone pot rolled all the way off, I don't like it personally)
5. Mid Scoop
6. Deep Scoop (Sounds like a neck mudbucker but has a hair of high end for clarity)

It also has treble-bleed on the volume pot, which behaves kind of like a bass-cut for about 1/8 - 1/4 of a turn. It's actually really useful for dialing down your bass frequencies a hair. For me it makes the volume knob actually useful, otherwise I could get by with a kill switch.

I got the varitone harness from Kellingsound on Ebay. He makes AMAZING stuff. Check him out. Here's one wired for urban contemporary and hip-hop (he says it should work well with a 5 stringer) : Fender P Bass Harness 6 Way Varitone Low End Settings Kellingsound | eBay. Otherwise look at his other auctions, he has other harnesses or standalone varitones you can put in your bass. He can also make custom stuff.

I have no affiliation with him, I just like his products and have used a few of them. He deserves more attention since his stuff is really creative yet still done tastefully.

One other avenue is to get a MFD P pickup from G&L. That's the most piano-like/hifi Precision pickup I've ever found.
Click to expand...


Thank you, that just may be what I'm looking for! Is your PBass with stock pickups? Your PBas sounds great and you're a very gifted musician!
 
#19
bassplayer2014 said:
Thank you, that just may be what I'm looking for! Is your PBass with stock pickups? Your PBas sounds great and you're a very gifted musician!
Click to expand...

Oh that's not me! I just found an example for you.

My project bass is a weird one :

IMG_1892.JPG

I'm actually starting a new project here. I picked up a Squier Classic Vibe 50s P bass. I'm adding an extra pickup, but I will for sure be using a varitone on it from that guy Kellingsound.
 
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#20
Lync said:
I would definitley just change strings first. Cheaper and Rotos or another quality SS rws will bring the piano. Plus if you hate them you can put the flats back on.
Click to expand...

I've been through quite a few different types of strings and they all still sound overly muddy, with low definition to me. On a positive note in a band setting my Fender AS P5 does what it's supposed to do: deliver the big bottom and sit very well in the mix.
 
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