Stripped Hex socket in truss rod || Help and ideas needed

[Conkal]

Hello all,

I have a beautifully sounding Warwick Corvette $$ 5 string , that costs too much for my current financial situation to replace(it now costs 3000+ euros....). I bought it new in 2008 for 1080 euros . I know it seems to be a steal but that was the price then.

This Warwick had a very stiff /hard-to-turn truss rod from the beggining but i was assured that it was normal .
Fast forward:
I have trusted this instrument to several technicians/ luthiers for setups through the years and someone among them used more force/or a damaged tool that damaged/stripped the hex socket . I don't know who and i dont care. I believe that the damage was additive over the years.

The last time that it was setup, i was present and the luthier told me that he was forced to use a bigger (13/64inches (5.2mm) instead of the 5mm allen ) to set it up. The bass was setup at last, and i used a lighter set of strings that usual to relieve the pressure.

This means that the neck can be setup now but i am afraid that it will give in shortly .

What should i do ? i really badly want to repair it, i love this sound

extra info
*the nut was 5mm but was stripped a bit.
* the nut is not replacable , it is part of the rod
* I talked to Warwick and they want a lot of money to replace the neck (almost the price of the instrument) 800+ shipping back and forth to germany...
* they dont sell any part that can be used by a local luthier. A fretboard, rod or the neck or anything. they insist that everything should be done by them.

I have been thinking of several DIY solution (or done by a luthier solutions) such as using epoxy to glue a metal extension with a torx-allen end. Use a torx screwdriver that may fit. use epoxy to sculpt the stripped parts of the hex socket in-place or anything useful.

Please i would really love to hear anything that can help.

 

[petrus61]

The nut isn't replaceable? Lame. IIRC, Warwick rods are easily replaced. It's just a matter of finding the correct rod (if indeed that is the proper way to go). Might want to do a search on Warwick replacement rods. It might be worth looking into whether it's possible to replace the rod with one that has a removeable nut, but I'm not sure if that's even feasible.

 

[Conkal]

Warwick representative told me that replacing the rod without sending it to their headquarters is out of the question as they do not sell all the needed parts. They told me that in order to replace the rod, a new fingerboard is needed. They do not sell a fingerboard.

is this true ? that a new fingerboard is needed?

 

[Arie X]

a couple of things:

-the neck won't "give in" because the adjustment nut is stripped. it's still playable, it just means that the hex socket is stripped. the socket is deep on those guys too and likely not to be damaged all the way down. do you have the factory wrench that came with the bass?

-ime, most non-artisan fixes just won't work for very long or work at all, sadly.

-warwick uses a darn burly trussrod assembly that unfortunately is unique to them. stripping out that socket you would think would be an achievement. a small dab of metal based anti-seize grease on the shoulder block helps tremendously but this needs to be done at build time. or one can use a hypo-needle to inject a bit of lube in there from the truss rod adjustment pocket. the older rods used steel on steel which will gall eventually without some sort of friction barrier, but the newer replacement ones seem to be using brass or bronze for the shoulder block which is an improvement.

-the last person doing work on the bass should have advised you that things were getting worse and discussed a solution.

-replacement rods can be found here:
WARWICK Parts for Instruments -> Warwick Spare Parts -> Truss Rods
i see a couple of choices there regarding build year and length

-the fretboard will have to come off to replace it but that doesn't mean you need a new one. s.o.p. for a competent luthier is to part the finish, steam off the board, install the rod, re-glue, spot finish, and do a final set-up etc... doable for the experienced craftsman.

 

[Conkal]

a couple of things:

-the neck won't "give in" because the adjustment nut is stripped. it's still playable, it just means that the hex socket is stripped. the socket is deep on those guys too and likely not to be damaged all the way down. do you have the factory wrench that came with the bass?

I wanted to say that i am afraid that the socket will be totally stripped and neither the bigger allen key would work.
I have the original but it doesnt have the grip to turn it.

-the last person doing work on the bass should have advised you that things were getting worse and discussed a solution.

The last persons (they are 2 of them ) both noted it but managed to setup the bass in the end and the matter was postponed for the next setup.

-replacement rods can be found here:
WARWICK Parts for Instruments -> Warwick Spare Parts -> Truss Rods
i see a couple of choices there regarding build year and length

I can find the rod , it is really cheap. But Warwick told me that the fretboard should also be changed and they do not sell this part (which makes no sense for me)

-the fretboard will have to come off to replace it but that doesn't mean you need a new one. s.o.p. for a competent luthier is to part the finish, steam off the board, install the rod, re-glue, spot finish, and do a final set-up etc... doable for the experienced craftsman.

I have spoken to a luthier and i will visit him.

 

[Arie X]

-sounds good.

correction: I meant to say "heat off the fretboard". usually a "fret iron" or equivalent is employed to heat up the glue joint between the board and the neck then the board is pried off slowly. "steaming" is used to remove a set neck from the body often by drilling a hole through the board underneath a pulled out fret and injecting steam to soften up the glue.

 

[Matt Liebenau]

If the fretboard can’t be reused after it is removed, another one can be made. It doesn’t have to come from Warwick. You or the luthier you are working with should be able to find similar wood and either slot it or order it preslotted in the correct scale length.

 

[BurnOut]

Can you unscrew it now? What happens if you unscrew it all the way? If it comes out, a small machine shop could make a new one fairly easy. I don't know how Warwick does their truss rods. I definitely would see if I could pull it out and make a new one, if it's possible.
Or maybe I'm out to lunch here, good luck with it.

 

[Zooberwerx]

Swapped stories with Mike Lull about this and we're both guilty:

I was forced to modify a rounded-out (?) hex socket on a dual acting truss rod such as your's. Luckily, the TR access was just wide enough to accommodate a Dremel flex cable and handset loaded with a micro-burr. I was able, with some patience, to grind notches on opposing sides of the TR nut deep enough to accept the business end of a right angle screwdriver. Didn't cost me anything, worked like a charm, and also came to the conclusion I'd be a lousy dentist.

Riis

 

[Conkal]

Can you unscrew it now? What happens if you unscrew it all the way? If it comes out, a small machine shop could make a new one fairly easy. I don't know how Warwick does their truss rods. I definitely would see if I could pull it out and make a new one, if it's possible.
Or maybe I'm out to lunch here, good luck with it.

The truss rod is one piece. You cant remove anything from it to replace.

 

[Conkal]

If the fretboard can’t be reused after it is removed, another one can be made. It doesn’t have to come from Warwick. You or the luthier you are working with should be able to find similar wood and either slot it or order it preslotted in the correct scale length.

I am not sure I would place my confident to any local luthier for finding the wood and doing this work for me, if he botches the fretboard removal....

 

[Conkal]

Swapped stories with Mike Lull about this and we're both guilty:

I was forced to modify a rounded-out (?) hex socket on a dual acting truss rod such as your's. Luckily, the TR access was just wide enough to accommodate a Dremel flex cable and handset loaded with a micro-burr. I was able, with some patience, to grind grind notches on opposing sides of the TR nut deep enough to the business end of a right angle screwdriver. Didn't cost me anything, worked like a charm, and also came to the conclusion I'd be a lousy dentist.

Riis

That was one solution that i was thinking about.

 

[BurnOut]

The next size up in Allen wrenches might get you a grip on it especially going to metric to English or English to metric, that way the next bigger size isn't as big as the normal next biggest size of a said set, get the decimal equivalents of the all wrenches available, a ball end wrench only a hair bigger (and I do mean a hair), might provide the bite you need, plus the taper on the ball end helps to insert it in the wallered out hex.

 

[Conkal]

I would need something bigger than 5mm. 5.5mm in very big. So i suspect that 13/64 inch would be it. I cant find something like this anywhere.

Can anyone ?

 

[Zooberwerx]

The next size up in Allen wrenches might get you a grip on it especially going to metric to English or English to metric, that way the next bigger size isn't as big as the normal next biggest size of a said set, get the decimal equivalents of the all wrenches available, a ball end wrench only a hair bigger (and I do mean a hair), might provide the bite you need, plus the taper on the ball end helps to insert it in the wallered out hex.

Another possibility is to ditch the hex key and, instead, try an appropriately-sized Torx bit. This may provide the necessary "bite" when engaging what remains of the hex socket. The Warwick's tilt-back headstock may allow a straight shot.

Riis

 

[Conkal]

Another possibility is to ditch the hex key and, instead, try an appropriately-sized Torx bit. This may provide the necessary "bite" when engaging what remains of the hex socket. The Warwick's tilt-back headstock may allow a straight shot.
Riis

Ι will have to try , but still 5 mm torx is small 5.5mm torx is big... i am searching for the intermediate but still without luck yet

 

[Zooberwerx]

Ι will have to try , but still 5 mm torx is small 5.5mm torx is big... i am searching for the intermediate but still without luck yet

You can probably fabricate an in-between size by filing down a 5.5 Torx. I've done the same with hex keys.

Riis

 

[Conkal]

This should be the next step i think.

 

[96tbird]

I am not sure I would place my confident to any local luthier for finding the wood and doing this work for me, if he botches the fretboard removal....

Luthiers build instruments. A decent one should have no problem removing a fretboard and making the repair. Many amateurs here in TB have successfully done it themselves so a true luthier would have no problem. People who only “repair” instruments are NOT luthiers. Find a true luthier, one that can actually build an acoustic instrument because they are familiar with working with GLUE and have the experience to repair glued parts on instruments.

Dudes at guitar shops are rarely actual luthiers.

 

[202dy]

Luthiers build instruments. A decent one should have no problem removing a fretboard and making the repair. Many amateurs here in TB have successfully done it themselves so a true luthier would have no problem. People who only “repair” instruments are NOT luthiers. Find a true luthier, one that can actually build an acoustic instrument because they are familiar with working with GLUE and have the experience to repair glued parts on instruments.

Dudes at guitar shops are rarely actual luthiers.

Dissenting opinion:

Luthiers build. For the most part they do not do repair work. As a general rule, builders are a poor choice for repair work.

Repairmen (techs, etc.) specialize in in taking things apart, repairing, and reassembling. They are separate, but related, disciplines. However, the tech does it every day.

It's the same for all manufactured things. (A one-off luthier is engaged in manufacturing.) For instance, the folks who build cars are not usually mechanics. People who build major appliances usually call the local repair shop when they have a problem.

When there is a down turn in the home building industry, many new home builders will try their hand at remodeling. Some succeed. But most fail. Tearing into a fifty or hundred year old wall requires different skills and knowledge than framing a western platform ranch.

Major guitar makers do not do repair work. When they do they charge a premium. Fender, Gibson, Martin, et al have a network of authorized repair centers i.e. local repair shops they recommend and trust that they direct their customers to when they have a problem.

There are exceptions. Some folks are trained across both crafts. But they are rare.

Respectfully submitted.