Technique...

ZAR14

ZAR14

May 15, 2016
810
717
4,551
Cleveland,OH
#1
My Bass Brothers and Sisters...I'm in need of some helpful advice.
I have recently joined a "start up" band which consists of local veteran musicians which will be fronted by a female lead singer, (also a local verteran).
One of the songs we will be playing is Hot Stuff from Donna Summer. A relatively easy song that basically plays the octaves of the progression with rapid, "Rata tat tat" Raking style.
Im an older guy (mid 50s) and admittedly have noticed some slightly "Diminished Skills". My finger have lost some dexterity and flexibility. I'm having some difficulty Raking the progression without fumbling and sounding sloppy.
I was able to "Rake" back in the day but never great at it. My attemps to play it has me tripping over my finger...Is there any advice you can offer?
Thanks
 
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#2
ZAR14 said:
My Bass Brothers and Sisters...I'm in need of some helpful advice.
I have recently joined a "start up" band which consists of local veteran musicians which will be fronted by a female lead singer, (also a local verteran).
One of the songs we will be playing is Hot Stuff from Donna Summer. A relatively easy song that basically plays the octaves of the progression with rapid, "Rata tat tat" Raking style.
Im an older guy (mid 50s) and admittedly have noticed some slightly "Diminished Skills". My finger have lost some dexterity and flexibility. I'm having some difficulty Raking the progression without fumbling and sounding sloppy.
I was able to "Rake" back in the day but never great at it. My attemps to play it has me tripping over my finger...Is there any advice you can offer?
Thanks
Click to expand...

My advice is to post in the Technique forum.
 
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#3
Well I think you can try three things if you have finger problems, like flexibility...

A)Try a compressor pedal with some gain to make your bass easier, also try mounting thinner strings (es. light gauge instead of mediums).
B)Change the bassline at your taste. If you support the singer, your cover would be a custom cover not a precise cover. Not a crime. To be honest, I like customized covers.
C)Try with a pick (lowering trebles and/or mids on the amp, since it has a more aggressive sound instead of fingers, until it sound "similar" with fingerstyle)
 
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#6
Instead of trying to “rake” the bassline with just your fingers try using your thumb to play the root and fingers for the upper octaves. Not slap style, but more like a classical guitarist would. This is a ton easier if you use the floating thumb technique.

Macho man is probably the best song ever to practice this technique to.
 
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#7
Sid the Kid said:
Instead of trying to “rake” the bassline with just your fingers try using your thumb to play the root and fingers for the upper octaves. Not slap style, but more like a classical guitarist would. This is a ton easier if you use the floating thumb technique.

Macho man is probably the best song ever to practice this technique to.
Click to expand...
TY Sid
 
#9
Sid the Kid said:
Instead of trying to “rake” the bassline with just your fingers try using your thumb to play the root and fingers for the upper octaves. Not slap style, but more like a classical guitarist would. This is a ton easier if you use the floating thumb technique.

Macho man is probably the best song ever to practice this technique to.
Click to expand...

I was just about to suggest the exact same thing... the action sort of feels like rolling a ball in-between your thumb and finger and it works great for octaves.
 
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#10
Get a metronome and slow it down to the tempo of glacial drift. Really pay attention to the muscle motion and look for ways to economize. Make sure you are relaxed. So many technical problems come from tensing up during tricky parts.

Start to speed up the metronome, but make sure any speed you are at is down cold. If it gets sloppy, back it down. You may have to start over and try altering you fingering like starting on the middle finger and what not.
 
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#11
Scottgun said:
Get a metronome and slow it down to the tempo of glacial drift. Really pay attention to the muscle motion and look for ways to economize. Make sure you are relaxed. So many technical problems come from tensing up during tricky parts.

Start to speed up the metronome, but make sure any speed you are at is down cold. If it gets sloppy, back it down. You may have to start over and try altering you fingering like starting on the middle finger and what not.
Click to expand...
+1 to this!
My band and I use the analogy of record player speeds:
45rpm being 'normal' speed
33rpm is what we slow it down to in order to lock in with each other, etc.
16rpm is when we really need to be sure that the timing on something is right or one (or more of us) have to really work through a complicated part
78rpm is for when we're "sure" that we have it down and are trying to prove it to ourselves... or to show off :laugh:
 
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#12
Scottgun said:
Get a metronome and slow it down to the tempo of glacial drift. Really pay attention to the muscle motion and look for ways to economize. Make sure you are relaxed. So many technical problems come from tensing up during tricky parts.

Start to speed up the metronome, but make sure any speed you are at is down cold. If it gets sloppy, back it down. You may have to start over and try altering you fingering like starting on the middle finger and what not.
Click to expand...
TY Scott
 
#16
OP - I have similar issues. I've recently been working through a lot of songs in that genre (including that song) and don't find the octave bounce very comfortable. I tried the thumb-finger pick as suggested above and while it's much easier, I find I can't get a comparable volume to my normal finger picking, so I get very little root and a lot of octave. So I just do it with my fingers, well in my case my index finger. Work it, work it work it. It gets easier, but it takes some time. IF you find your self fumbling, focus on hitting the upbeat the octave - the ear will assume the downbeat so it is less missed. I've also found that keeping the octave very staccato it sounds little cleaner.

Also pay close attention to your fretting hand - I find now that that's where I run into more issues (keeping the pinky in sync with my forefinger) than the plucking hand at this point.

Good Luck
 
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#18
mrcbass said:
OP - I have similar issues. I've recently been working through a lot of songs in that genre (including that song) and don't find the octave bounce very comfortable. I tried the thumb-finger pick as suggested above and while it's much easier, I find I can't get a comparable volume to my normal finger picking, so I get very little root and a lot of octave. So I just do it with my fingers, well in my case my index finger. Work it, work it work it. It gets easier, but it takes some time. IF you find your self fumbling, focus on hitting the upbeat the octave - the ear will assume the downbeat so it is less missed. I've also found that keeping the octave very staccato it sounds little cleaner.

Also pay close attention to your fretting hand - I find now that that's where I run into more issues (keeping the pinky in sync with my forefinger) than the plucking hand at this point.

Good Luck
Click to expand...
TY mrcbass, Appreciated
 
#19
It's pretty hard stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if the original was played on some electronics. Comes to my mind:
A/ do it the way you know. The key to learn anything fast is to practise SLOWLY with click or drums, as no doubt you know. It pays off to focus on painlessness. If you rest your right forearm on the body of the bass, try to lift it up and generally play with lighter, less rigid movements.
B/ learn free stroke. I'm not an expert, but I can use it for playing octaves. It's not very easy to learn, but it's not that hard either, and then it is very easy to play fast. Check Talkingbass.net lesson1, lesson2, lesson3.
 
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#20
ZAR14 said:
My Bass Brothers and Sisters...I'm in need of some helpful advice.
I have recently joined a "start up" band which consists of local veteran musicians which will be fronted by a female lead singer, (also a local verteran).
One of the songs we will be playing is Hot Stuff from Donna Summer. A relatively easy song that basically plays the octaves of the progression with rapid, "Rata tat tat" Raking style.
Im an older guy (mid 50s) and admittedly have noticed some slightly "Diminished Skills". My finger have lost some dexterity and flexibility. I'm having some difficulty Raking the progression without fumbling and sounding sloppy.
I was able to "Rake" back in the day but never great at it. My attemps to play it has me tripping over my finger...Is there any advice you can offer?
Thanks
Click to expand...
May not be the best advice, but if it were me I’d start by warming up my fingers each and every time I picked up my bass. Kind of like a pitcher warming up before entering the game. After 20 minutes or so of some simple warmup exercises, start playing the song very slowly. Gradually increase the tempo over time and you should start to free the difference. Give yourself a good month or so.
 
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