Three Band EQ vs Four Band EQ (and what about pedals?)

ClinicianBass

ClinicianBass

Apr 21, 2019
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#1
Hello, I plan on purchasing a JJ or PJ style of bass, putting some form of flatwounds on it, and cranking out some Motown, Blues Rock and Macca lines, while hopefully writing counterpoint to my own original music. Anyways, regarding tonal versatility, how necessary is having four band EQ on a bass amp? It seems that having control of lower and upper mids would be important, but most Ampegs I've seen don't have it, and actually, Acoustics are the only brand I regularly find it in. On top of this, should I try to get something along the lines of the MXR 10-band EQ? I also play guitar so the high frequencies will be used, but I just don't know if I should or if 3/4 band EQ gives enough control for the time being.

Thanks! ✌️
 
#2
I too like to adjust lower and higher mids independently, but, before all that, gotta have, well, mid-mids. Like, MIDS, man. Therefore I'd rather have a 3 band than a 4-band, but would of course prefer a 5(+) band one.
 
#4
Zbysek said:
It's not neccessary...as long as the mids control is (semi)parametric...
Click to expand...
Something I like a lot is having your regular 3band and then, on the side, a boost/cut parametric equalizer that ranges from the deepest, lowest bass and the most icepick treble you can think of, that can be switched on and off, so you can bring out really precise and specific frequencies you'd otherwise be able to get only with a graphic EQ. Can't remember on which amp I found this feature.
 
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#5
ObeyDaRiffness said:
Something I like a lot is having your regular 3band and then, on the side, a boost/cut parametric equalizer that ranges from the deepest, lowest bass and the most icepick treble you can think of, that can be switched on and off, so you can bring out really precise and specific frequencies you'd otherwise be able to get only with a graphic EQ. Can't remember on which amp I found this feature.
Click to expand...


You can get it in a small pedal....like BMC2 from E.W.S. The range is 160Hz - 2,5kHz

Bass Mid Control 2｜E.W.S.
 
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#7
I find dual mids rather pointless....but
I'm sure there is plenty of opinions.

A good basic tone stack is completely fine.

Most " tone" comes from the players skills and bass.

Far as needing ridiculous tone adjustments and sweeping this and semi that.... whatever.

Basic 3 band is fine.
As far as multi band EQs they are very very nice for cutting frequencies in difficult rooms. Or cutting frequencies with very high gain distortion.

I've always liked the boss pedal. Works fine going straight in or in a effects loop. Really nice for cutting trouble areas. Or boosting to get a nice mix in recordings.

There is incredible amount of interesting things you can do with filters and even modulation. But that's more genre specific like synth tones. Or experimental type of music.

For straight " Motown" sound. Just the players hands and the bass pickup used or amount roll off on the bass is fine.

The natural scoop sound from basic 2 band tone controls actually works rather well. As found on older ampegs.

Or the basic 2 band control on a bassman 50 which is common 3 band with set midrange. And likewise has a unique curve when deep switch is engaged.

Some super amazing ultra hyped mega knob " tone control" won't give you " tone
It's really really in the players hands and techniques. And very good players can just literally bypass everything plug straight to the board. And nail a certain tone. With just a P bass or a J bass.

Some may like the PJ style bass. But I really can't stand them. It takes the magic away from the standard dual singles found on a J and is pointless otherwise since a P covers it's thing without the additional pick up
 
#11
BogeyBass said:
I find dual mids rather pointless....but
I'm sure there is plenty of opinions...

Basic 3 band is fine.

It's really really in the players hands and techniques. And very good players can just literally bypass everything plug straight to the board. And nail a certain tone. With just a P bass or a J bass.

Some may like the PJ style bass. But I really can't stand them. It takes the magic away from the standard dual singles found on a J and is pointless otherwise since a P covers it's thing without the additional pick up
Click to expand...
I suppose you're right, I feel like I'm just overthinking my future bass rig because it's mostly new to me. I've always been pretty good at emulating playing technique and sound on guitar so I really should be fine. If I have an easy choice that comes down to a three vs four band I'll probably pick the latter but I really just need to make my choice and get everything.

I do disagree about the PJ as though I love the sound of a good Precision and I think it fits anywhere and everywhere, I also like the bite of the bridge pickup and blended sounds quite a bit too, and would prefer to just have it. But I understand what you mean and would be fine with just a P or just a JJ config. I wish there was more usage of the jazz bass in the 60's, but by then everyone was either playing a Precision or for a lot of the British bands, a European brand like Hofner or Burns. My dream bass would be something like Carl Radle's; an early 50's Precision with the split coil in normal position and the single coil a couple inches closer to the bridge.
 
#13
I really like my Genz Benz Shuttle’s mid parametric EQ. It helps to find that midrange region that either needs cutting (often) or boosting (sometimes). I’ve never found an amp has magically picked the exact right mid frequency for every situation (bass, cabinet, room, etc.) which is why I love having the ability to zero in on the frequency I want to affect. Just my opinion/experience.
 
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#14
ObeyDaRiffness said:
I too like to adjust lower and higher mids independently, but, before all that, gotta have, well, mid-mids. Like, MIDS, man. Therefore I'd rather have a 3 band than a 4-band, but would of course prefer a 5(+) band one.
Click to expand...
EWS BMC2 Pedal
Middle knob: mid boost/cut ±12dB
Frequency knob: EQ frequency Range is 160Hz~2.5KHz.
Volume knob: max. of +6dB output gain boost is possible.
Gain Boost toggle SW : +10dB gain increase at input stage.
item_BMC2_side.jpg
 
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#15
Certain tone curve comes about with the interaction of using the volume knobs and tone on a Jazz. Has a unique midrange. Or very deep or very bright.
Likewise as far as picking or plucking areas that really define bass are somewhat magically laid out by the J bass pickup locations.

Basically 4 main areas on all basses but little ahead of the J bass front pickup and little behind. Had big tonal changes.

Likewise little ahead and little behind bridge pickup has big tonal changes.

Volume neck all up
Volume bridge all down

Volume bridge all up
Volume neck all down

Magic mids comes from combination of half way bridge or half way neck volumes. With the other knob all the way.

I like round wound and flat sound as well.
But found the half way up / all the way up combination of a J and the tone of flats works well.

By all means the fresh bright new sound of classic Rotosounds and the P bass will mend pick or finger styles. And using the same 4 main areas. Will totally nail alot of tone straight to the board.

Possible competition among manufactures and constant reinvention of the wheel or the need for Blinky winky lights and billions of other amplifier features

Has possible confused or overwhelmed players over the years into over thinking.

Likewise unexpeirenced players who like to tell you what a fender tone stack does and doesn't do blah blah.

With skills and consistent technique on the instrument. Basically a wealth of tone can be found with just your old P or J bass and the very well designed tone curves of a Bassman 50 or 100.

I'm sure some snobs would find a laugh fest in that. Unfortunately after you've heard renowned session players just basically plug into anything and not complain a word and nail tracks with alot of " tone"
I'm well aware of what kind of "opinions" come from certain types of players
 
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#16
I like them both, though, I have not played though the newer Acoustics, only the older models. I recently bought an Ampeg SVT III (the non-pro version) and am very much liking the flexibility of the EQ section. (It doesn't sound quite like the newer Ampeg offerings to my ear though).

I mean, they are just eq sections, they either give you the shaping you want or they don't. What they can't do is get past the inherent voice and character of the amp which ends up mattering more as far as potential limits to your tonal options. I like the stock Ampeg voicing, but my gig rig is SWR which gives me the cut and definition I prefer.

Digression alert:
That said, for a credible Motown vibe (I'm assuming Jamerson style thump) the attack and decay of the note almost matters more than the extent of eq options on the head. It wasn't just that Jamerson was using flats. He was using heavy, old flats on a bowed neck (high action) with the foam mute installed. That contributed to an upright like punch and definition to the note which an amp on its own can't create. Also, his tone wasn't about a huge low end, but highly compressed, slightly overdriven mids, gotten by redlining a limiter and channel strip. (IIRC) I'd say the Ampeg tone stack has an easier time accommodating that out of the box.

It is very easy to overthink this stuff and get caught up in the numbers, features, etc. I like to use amps that let me express what I want quickly. Go play a bunch and see which one inspires you to play rather than fiddle with the knobs too much.

Last word: the PJ is a unique voice. It isn't a P, it isn't a J. It's its own thang.
 
#17
Tone comes from the player AND the instrument.

If you want to change eq... good luck from fingers alone.

If you like more presence in your tone, 3 band without variable freq will typically be lower than presence range. 4 band is lower mids then presence area (upper mids).

It's much more useful imho than 3 band where i typically don't use the mid control much.

Semi para is my favorite but 4 band like the newer ernie ball design are great also.
 
#18
I'd posit that most of the amps and preamps I own don't have 4 bands, but they are all semi parametric. My Walter Woods has one semi parametric mid range control, the Grace Designs Felix has a switchable, dual range, semi parametric midrange,
where you can cut or boost the midrange, set the center frequency, and the bandwidth around it's center. I those controls.
 
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#19
ClinicianBass said:
I suppose you're right, I feel like I'm just overthinking my future bass rig because it's mostly new to me. I've always been pretty good at emulating playing technique and sound on guitar so I really should be fine. If I have an easy choice that comes down to a three vs four band I'll probably pick the latter but I really just need to make my choice and get everything.

I do disagree about the PJ as though I love the sound of a good Precision and I think it fits anywhere and everywhere, I also like the bite of the bridge pickup and blended sounds quite a bit too, and would prefer to just have it. But I understand what you mean and would be fine with just a P or just a JJ config. I wish there was more usage of the jazz bass in the 60's, but by then everyone was either playing a Precision or for a lot of the British bands, a European brand like Hofner or Burns. My dream bass would be something like Carl Radle's; an early 50's Precision with the split coil in normal position and the single coil a couple inches closer to the bridge.
Click to expand...
Not sure where you are getting that. Jazz Basses were all over the radio in the sixties. Jemmott, Osborn and J.P. Jones to name a few. As for your question regarding bands of eq, no, multiple bands are not necessary to achieve versatility Especially with a J bass. I personally do not care for the P/J set up, though many love it. To me it neither captures the P bass or the J bass tone. It is it's own thing though and if you like it why not?
 
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#20
ClinicianBass said:
Hello, I plan on purchasing a JJ or PJ style of bass, putting some form of flatwounds on it, and cranking out some Motown, Blues Rock and Macca lines, while hopefully writing counterpoint to my own original music. Anyways, regarding tonal versatility, how necessary is having four band EQ on a bass amp? It seems that having control of lower and upper mids would be important, but most Ampegs I've seen don't have it, and actually, Acoustics are the only brand I regularly find it in. On top of this, should I try to get something along the lines of the MXR 10-band EQ? I also play guitar so the high frequencies will be used, but I just don't know if I should or if 3/4 band EQ gives enough control for the time being.

Thanks! ✌️
Click to expand...


It depends if the frequency centers and bandwidths of your amp's tone controls are setup exactly they way you like them, and if you have one idea of good tone or many. It also depends on whether you use your tone controls only to dial in a sound, or also to compensate for problem room acoustics. In another words, the answer entirely depends upon your preferences and how you use EQ.

I tend to prefer more powerful EQ sections, but I enjoy tweaking and I have enough experience to understand what I am doing. Back in the early 80s I bought an Orban 672A, which was described as an 8-band para-graphic EQ. Essentially it's a parametric EQ that is layed out like a graphic EQ. The only thing that limits it from being fully parametric is the frequency bands are not continuously variable from 20-20kHz. Adjacent bands do overlap significantly though.

I have an MXR KFK 10-band EQ and it's a decent enough tool for the price. You may also consider some of the semi-parametric pedal EQs like the Empress ParaEQ and the Tech21 Q Strip.

Or you might consider an amp like the Mesa WD-800, which has a variable HPF; Bass, Middle, and Treble; plus three bands of semi-parametric mids. If you're not tweaker you might want to stick with a more basic amp like an Orange AD200B.
 
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