Treble Cut Switch/ Dual Cut switch

M

MCPLBASS

Dec 15, 2018
11
1
4,531
#1
Hi, I am designing a custom wiring project for a bass with 3 pickups for complete versatility.

I have a couple questions before I start drawing it all out. I would prefer not too have a lot of knobs, so I would rather use DPDT slide switches.

1) I have a 3 way On/on/on DPDT switch I would like to use as a treble cut switch to replace the standard tone knob. This will be for the middle and bridge pickups which will be wired like a jazz bass (2 V) with a series/parallel switch.

For this switch, how can I wire it to make:
middle position= standard bypass, no cut
Up= .022uF Treble Cut
Down= .047uF Treble cut

2) I also have a 2 way DPDT On/on slide switch that I would like to use to make:

Up= Standard bypass, no cut
Down= Treble cut neck pickup + Bass cut Middle/Bridge pickup

What is the best option to do this?

I understand that bass cut typically deal between 0.0015uF- 0.0033uF and that I would have to trial and error to find the right value for the sound I want.
I am just trying to learn how the switches would be wired up.

Thanks in advance!
 
#2
You can use a on-off-on for your tone switch. you may find your values too high but you can always change that after.
A .0033 is a good starting point for a bass cut cap. Wire the mid and bridge pup to the bass cut switch then to the volume. The Bass VIs strangle switch method is good to copy
 
#3
Umm, I'm not sure if I'm following correctly, but you cannot have independent tone controls (even if they're simply switches with caps) on two sets of pickups because they are parallel to the pickups. In other words, when you will engage the treble cut on, say, the "middle+bridge pickup", the treble will be cut from all pickups that are engaged. The only control that can work independently on one set of pickups is bass cut, because it's wired in series with those pickups.

That said, your idea could work if
  • you used appropriate active electronics and actively mixed the neck and bridge+middle pickup
  • you could have a treble cut on one set of pickups work independently if the two sets of pickups were wired in series (similar to OMG wiring)
  • you could ignore all this if you intend to use neck pickup mainly by itself, and bridge+middle pickups mainly by themselves
I may be missing something, but that's the way I see it.
 
#4
ChristoMephisto said:
You can use a on-off-on for your tone switch. you may find your values too high but you can always change that after.
A .0033 is a good starting point for a bass cut cap. Wire the mid and bridge pup to the bass cut switch then to the volume. The Bass VIs strangle switch method is good to copy
Click to expand...

Thank you! What would the wiring look like for the tone switch? I'm having a hard time finding a diagram.
 
#5
sikamikanico said:
Umm, I'm not sure if I'm following correctly, but you cannot have independent tone controls (even if they're simply switches with caps) on two sets of pickups because they are parallel to the pickups. In other words, when you will engage the treble cut on, say, the "middle+bridge pickup", the treble will be cut from all pickups that are engaged. The only control that can work independently on one set of pickups is bass cut, because it's wired in series with those pickups.

That said, your idea could work if
  • you used appropriate active electronics and actively mixed the neck and bridge+middle pickup
  • you could have a treble cut on one set of pickups work independently if the two sets of pickups were wired in series (similar to OMG wiring)
  • you could ignore all this if you intend to use neck pickup mainly by itself, and bridge+middle pickups mainly by themselves
I may be missing something, but that's the way I see it.
Click to expand...

Thank you for your response. I would like to keep the circuit passive. In my head, this circuit would only work when the pups are in series.

What if I wired the mid+bridge with all its volume pots and switches directly to the jack, and the neck with its pot and switch directly to the jack?

Failing that, my main priority is learning how to wire a switch to have it cut the bass of one pup and cut the treble of the other. I have seen it done before but no diagram is available and my dpdt switch knowledge is scarce.
 
#6
For the tone switch it could be a simple spdt or dpdt switch (center off)
The middle wire connects to the volume input, and put the caps on each end and then connect the caps to ground.
But like the OP said, if the pups are parallel then one cap will effect them both.

For the bass cut look up Bass VI wiring diagrams for how to wire up a strangle switch.
 
#7
MCPLBASS said:
What if I wired the mid+bridge with all its volume pots and switches directly to the jack, and the neck with its pot and switch directly to the jack?
Click to expand...

That’s still parallel wiring. Unless you use two different jacks.


MCPLBASS said:
Failing that, my main priority is learning how to wire a switch to have it cut the bass of one pup and cut the treble of the other. I have seen it done before but no diagram is available and my dpdt switch knowledge is scarce.
Click to expand...

I dont think that’s possible, but I may not be aware of all possibilities. I too would be curious to hear the solution if it exists!
 
#9
sikamikanico said:
That’s still parallel wiring. Unless you use two different jacks.



I dont think that’s possible, but I may not be aware of all possibilities. I too would be curious to hear the solution if it exists!
Click to expand...

This guy does it. Seems like it helps give it that vintage Rickenbacker tone all at the power of one mini toggle switch. Check it out at 8:45:
 
#10
ChristoMephisto said:
For the tone switch it could be a simple spdt or dpdt switch (center off)
The middle wire connects to the volume input, and put the caps on each end and then connect the caps to ground.
But like the OP said, if the pups are parallel then one cap will effect them both.

For the bass cut look up Bass VI wiring diagrams for how to wire up a strangle switch.
Click to expand...

So the middle lug will be both the input and the output? Then a 0.022 uF cap on the top lug with the other leg to ground, and a 0.047uF cap on the bottom lug with the other lug to ground. Is it that simple?
 
#12
MCPLBASS said:
This guy does it. Seems like it helps give it that vintage Rickenbacker tone all at the power of one mini toggle switch. Check it out at 8:45:
Click to expand...


Rick wiring is a cap in series with the bridge pickup (bass cut). I'm not sure how he gets just the bass frequencies from the neck pickup at the same time... The only way I know that works (passively) is to do the OMG wiring thing, with a cap in parallel with the neck pickup (treble cut) which is then wired in series with the bridge pickup. If you then add a bass cut cap in series with the bridge pickup, you've effectively cut the bass from the combined signal, no? But if you do it in parallel, where bass cut works on the bridge pickup, the treble cut works on both pickups.

But this reminds me that there was this old Bill Lawrence wiring diagram that supposedly did something like that - getting treble from one pickup and bass from the other. I think it was for a PJ. I never did manage to wrap my brain around it, but it's around here somewhere...
 
#13
sikamikanico said:
Rick wiring is a cap in series with the bridge pickup (bass cut). I'm not sure how he gets just the bass frequencies from the neck pickup at the same time... The only way I know that works (passively) is to do the OMG wiring thing, with a cap in parallel with the neck pickup (treble cut) which is then wired in series with the bridge pickup. If you then add a bass cut cap in series with the bridge pickup, you've effectively cut the bass from the combined signal, no? But if you do it in parallel, where bass cut works on the bridge pickup, the treble cut works on both pickups.

But this reminds me that there was this old Bill Lawrence wiring diagram that supposedly did something like that - getting treble from one pickup and bass from the other. I think it was for a PJ. I never did manage to wrap my brain around it, but it's around here somewhere...
Click to expand...

There was one user on this site that managed to do it by modding his Hofner bass. I'm having trouble seeing the diagrams through my phone so I can't upload a picture. He describes it in depth in this thread:

How to rewire a Hofner violin bass control panel for more tones

I think that would work for me I just don't know how I'd incorporate a 3rd pickup into it.
 
#14
MCPLBASS said:
There was one user on this site that managed to do it by modding his Hofner bass. I'm having trouble seeing the diagrams through my phone so I can't upload a picture. He describes it in depth in this thread:

How to rewire a Hofner violin bass control panel for more tones

I think that would work for me I just don't know how I'd incorporate a 3rd pickup into it.
Click to expand...

Ah, doh: you can isolate the pickups passively if you don't use volume controls on full (or add some resistance). I just personally don't like that solution, because that also kills some highs, though I haven't tried it seriously. Perhaps it works better with some pickups than others?

With three pickups, you could always treat two as one. I thought you were thinking of middle and bridge pickups this way? Though I'd just use one volume control for both, and have a selector switch for middle-series-parallel-bridge.

I suggest you try a few different wiring schemes, just with alligator leads, see what you like...
 
#15
sikamikanico said:
Ah, doh: you can isolate the pickups passively if you don't use volume controls on full (or add some resistance). I just personally don't like that solution, because that also kills some highs, though I haven't tried it seriously. Perhaps it works better with some pickups than others?

With three pickups, you could always treat two as one. I thought you were thinking of middle and bridge pickups this way? Though I'd just use one volume control for both, and have a selector switch for middle-series-parallel-bridge.

I suggest you try a few different wiring schemes, just with alligator leads, see what you like...
Click to expand...

Oh wow, I didn't even think of using a selector switch like that! I'd have to look into a 4 way switch. Although I kind of wanted to have seperate volume controls to help balance. Maybe a blend and a volume would be better?

I want to use the pickups to have all of the standard sounds with a twist.
1) Neck + Middle= Rickenbacker pickup placement. (The crossover/dual tone circuit would be mostly utilized here)
2) Middle only= P-Bass sweet spot
3) Middle +Bridge= standard PJ or Jazz layout
4) Bridge only= Music man almost sweet spot
5) Neck + Bridge= Hofner style (would be interesting to see what sound I'd get with the circuit)

I would like to have the option to leave all 3 open and see what sound of get, combined with some of the bass cuts and treble cuts as well.
 
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