What is your personal way of improvising on bass during a jam?

Shenron

Shenron

Jan 18, 2024
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#1
I sometimes find myself in such situation where, due to someone* being late to rehearsals, another someone** starts jamming some random chords, and the other someone*** picks it up without problem, and then everyone looks at me and expects me to easily jump up and figure out how to fill in with the bass... on those occasions when I do succeed at figuring out the key before the second someone** randomly changes it (with the third someone*** having the easiest time of their life since chords are irrelevant to them), I pretty much try to just find a simple usable groove as quickly as possible and stick to it. In the event the second someone** decides to keep the key long enough, I may start venturing into small variations and embellishment, but I find it impossible to improvise freely or try a solo... such selfish act would surely unpolitely step on the spotlight of the second someone** and leave the poor third someone*** alone in keeping up a weakened groove. :rolleyes:

*the singer, who else?
**the guitarist, who else??
***the drummer, who else???

How do you manage to make your jamming on bass more satisfying (when not jamming alone, that is)? Do you agree with your bandmates on a chord progression before starting the jam? Do you alternate on solos? Do you just enjoy chaos and mayhem and each one plays a different key/rhythm/genre/time signature?

I'd like to hear how you really manage to have fun jamming on bass (not just the theory of it, or how you think you should be jamming, but how you actually do) because maybe I'm just still too much a beginner on bass, but I find jamming a lot easier and more fun when I play in another role** or even another role***.
 
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#2
I do free-improv, so that's all I do. I listen, first and foremost, though sometimes I'll start things. Sometimes it's total noise/mayhem, other times it's reverb-laden dreamscapes, sometimes it's funky, some times it's just clicks and clacks. Wherever things lead, including cul de sacs. I think the most important thing in improv is to say YES, after listening.
 
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#6
I generally prefer anarchy, but only if playing with fellow travelers. In more typical jam band contexts I like the approach of telegraphing segues and feeling out when critical mass of the collective dictates a new direction.

And then when working from a jazz standard palette I especially like trading fours or other defined chunks, along with quoting other melodies and seeing what new thing might develop.
 
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#7
Shenron said:
starts jamming some random chords
Click to expand...

You need to Identify the chords, somehow: look at the guitarists hands, or listen , or assume it's E minor because guitarist.
until your vocabulary is big enough to just pick pickup what others are laying down, you need communicate about those chords

When I jam these days the instigator usually just calls out what the chords are.
Once I know the chords I have enough theory & style experience to take it and run.
 
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#11
There are no hard and fast rules. It all depends on the communication with the other musicians and the context. I've been improvising since my teens and one of the big misunderstandings about improvisation is that you don't have to practice or prepare for it. When you hear bands that improvise a lot, you know they have spent hours in the rehearsal room working on developing a language that works for them. So, you have to go through a lot of experimentation in approach and concepts. Once you've worked on it for a while, it gets easier. And better.
 
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#12
I always try to find something that grooves. Pedal, ostinato, walking, repeated riff, roots on one - the specifics matter far less than generating a feeling, and for me I do that with grooves. Or if it heads “out”, abandon all groove and really ditch the tonality. It depends, but I try to take any jam and steer it towards composition of some sort.
 
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#13
All of the above and ... I am lucky to play with two killer guitarists who call out keys/chords when necessary. I have never felt like I was being told what to play, the signals are offered in the spirit of ... "if your trying to figure out where we are at."

But my modus operandi is to find a one chord
Rhythm of some type and trance out till they get tired. I pop on various effects in the process to switch up the sound, and I try different dynamics, but I can play the same rhythm a long time before I get bored.
 
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#14
Shenron said:
I sometimes find myself in such situation where, due to someone* being late to rehearsals, another someone** starts jamming some random chords, and the other someone*** picks it up without problem, and then everyone looks at me and expects me to easily jump up and figure out how to fill in with the bass... on those occasions when I do succeed at figuring out the key before the second someone** randomly changes it (with the third someone*** having the easiest time of their life since chords are irrelevant to them), I pretty much try to just find a simple usable groove as quickly as possible and stick to it. In the event the second someone** decides to keep the key long enough, I may start venturing into small variations and embellishment, but I find it impossible to improvise freely or try a solo... such selfish act would surely unpolitely step on the spotlight of the second someone** and leave the poor third someone*** alone in keeping up a weakened groove. :rolleyes:

*the singer, who else?
**the guitarist, who else??
***the drummer, who else???

How do you manage to make your jamming on bass more satisfying (when not jamming alone, that is)? Do you agree with your bandmates on a chord progression before starting the jam? Do you alternate on solos? Do you just enjoy chaos and mayhem and each one plays a different key/rhythm/genre/time signature?

I'd like to hear how you really manage to have fun jamming on bass (not just the theory of it, or how you think you should be jamming, but how you actually do) because maybe I'm just still too much a beginner on bass, but I find jamming a lot easier and more fun when I play in another role** or even another role***.
Click to expand...
Just keep doing it, take chances, fail, learn and do better next time. Listen to the other players more than hyper focused on yourself. Listen for changes in the beat, anticipate the chord chages. It just takes time, keep doing it it and pushing yourself.
 
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#15
If it's just a pickup jam where you're all improvising, my advice to you is to not be shy - you gotta OWN that poopie :)

ID the chords if someone else starts and get into a groove with the drummer, or, preferably, you and the drummer start the groove and set the chords before someone else does. Why wait for the guitarist to start? Maybe even work out a few ideas ahead of time and then start the jam yourself.

Don't be afraid to shout out and ask "what key" or "what chords" to help you ID the notes. I rarely ID the chords before the jam, but good jam manners dictate that whoever starts the jam shouts them out.

Then from there, once you have a groove established, either by you starting one or you establishing one under someone else, take it from there. throw some fills in, experiment with changes, etc. Again, own that poopie!

As far as solos go - when you feel it appropriate, indicate that you are going to take a solo and then take it. Don't worry about stepping on someone else's spotlight, most good musicians would dig it. If they are decent musicians they will catch on soon enough.

Most importantly tho, just have fun and try not to stress about it. Free jams are amongst my favorite things!

All of this IMO/E of course.
 
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#16
As others said, there's not going to be any 1 rule that will work for all improv situations so the best thing to start with is to just listen. Ideally, listening for a bit will give you the common key which is what I'd start with personally. For something like the situation you have described, I'd find the key and start just doing a 1 note groove with the drummer. I find just staying on the root chord for a little bit allows me to hear the chord changes a bit better while also giving the jam some tension which you can then release once you start playing along with the changes.

Regarding the part where you mentioned that another guitar player comes in a starts changing the key, well, that I can't help you with aside from just learning the tendencies of the fellow musicians. I do have experience playing with some guitar players for many years and you do get an idea of where things are going to go after a while.
 
#18
First, I also play guitar and know my basic theory pretty well (took me a while, but I find that stuff interesting), so I can simply understand what the guitarist is doing, and then I work out something to suit it… or not. Not every jam idea works out for the group. If it’s not working out for me, I’ll make some suggestions or propose an alternate jam more up my alley (that won’t leave the guitarist out).

The thing is, bass and drums can jam in a way that a guitarist doesn’t have an obvious role in. Similarly, as you’ve said, a guitarist can come up with any crazy, shifting chord progression/sequence of riffs/freeform soloing and the drummer can play along as he doesn’t have to worry about key. So what might be missing here is that the guitarist and the bassist have to come up with something they can do together, and then the drummer can deal with whatever the result is. Essentially, one of you has to write a sketch of a song on the fly (or prepare beforehand, hint hint), or the two of you have to come up with one together. I dont mean a full song with words, and unless you really get literally into the songwriting part, you don’t have to come up with song parts like an intro, a chorus, a bridge or an outro. But you want the equivalent of a main progression of a song (adding a bridge section to occasionally change to can be fun, too).

Since it seems like you’re lost, if it were me, I’d tell the guitarist (in a way that keeps everything friendly and cooperative) that I need to know the progression. And I might say something like, "Let’s slow it down a hair" (or speed it up) or "Can we cut out the extra bit at the end there and just work on the main part with the two [or 6 or whatever] chords going back and forth for a while. Let me figure something out." Work with him to get to something you can handle and are comfortable with.
I also might say something like, "Let’s go back to that one we were doing the other day, the one in A that goes dah dah duh woo, and then you go all spacey". Like that, instead of inventing something new every single time, slowly build up over the weeks and months ahead a little "jam repertoire" of jams that work for everyone in the group.

Meanwhile, when the guitarist nods for you to take a solo, he’s trying to share. He’s (in his mind) giving you a chance to have some improvisational fun too instead of (in his mind) hogging all the fun creative stuff to himself. He probably doesn’t even understand the satisfaction you get of holding down the groove with the drummer and that you might have no desire to take a solo. He might also be encouraging you to stretch out a bit, and I think that’s how you should take it too, as a chance to mess around and try it. It’s just for fun after all. Basically, you need to know the right scale for the chords being used, and there’s a good chance that pentatonic minor or pentatonic major will work (depending on the progression). Turn it up a hair and run through the appropriate scale in a way that sounds cool to you. You don’t have to keep doing it — just go through the progression once, or if you think you were starting to get the hang of it (or have something more to say), continue over the progression one more time if you’d like, then hand it back to the guitarist and go back to your regular bass part that you’ve worked out. He’ll be psyched that you gave it a try. Also, you don’t have to try every time. It’s okay to pass. As long as you’re sometimes game, it should be fun.

When you guys are able to do that (after some weeks or months), you can start adding a second or 3rd section or otherwise incorporating "parts", because the drummer typically needs some different musical sections or else he’ll get bored. Example: every now and then add in two bars (or whatever) of silence on the part of the guitarist and bassist for the drummer to do a fill in. Or, add in a higher energy section with more distortion and maybe faster tempo than the main section. Or, as I mentioned above, have a bridge section (for example, if the main part is in a major key, add a complementary progression in the relative minor as a "bridge" to throw in sometimes). But all that comes later. First you have to work on a couple of simple chord progressions that you and the guitarist can agree on. Repeat them until they become comfortable
 
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#19
I’m not much of a jammer. When I audition for, or join a band, I make it clear that my goal is gigs, and I want to learn songs and go play them. Most jamming, for me, is a waste of time.

BUT, some years ago, my wife bought me a ticket to a master class with Victor Wooten. He opened my mind to concepts I had never thought of, and taught me new ways of looking at scales. I’m now much more prepared to jam a little, if need be, and I’ve been slowly growing into the stuff that VW exposed me to.
 
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