A (Somewhat) Definitive Guide To The Matthew Garrison Technique And Playing Ramps

#102
Well, if it's comfortable and you can make it work for you, then there's nothing wrong with it. Another TBer (I think it was Don't Fret) did it that way a few years ago when I met him and he made it work fine. The benefits of going TIMR for me are:
1. I tend to get that triplet gallop when plucking RMI- going IMR fights that
2. After plucking with your thumb, your ring finger is usually higher up than your index, so getting it to come down as quickly as the index is harder for me and I imagine for many others.
Both of these things can be overcome with practice I'm sure, but it will mean putting in a bit of effort even when going with the more natural hand motion. RMI is more natural for most people- when I tap my fingers, I'm still faster and more coordinated going ring to thumb. But I am faster and more even when plucking thumb to ring. If you're considering going either way, I'd give both good amount of practice time, as getting the technique under your fingers takes a lot of time as is, let alone trying it out two different ways.
 
#103
There really isn't much of a benefit

DiPiazza plays thumb-ring-middle index, Garrison plays thumb-index-middle-ring. Both play crazy fast and complex stuff, both have practiced their way for years and years. Whatever feels better, is better.

I did the Garrison pattern because I was already used to playing double thumb, so Thumb-Thumb-Index-Ring was already under my belt and I just had to add my ring finger into the equation

So all in all, whatever pattern will lend itself to playing fluidly for you is best. However, you shouldn't fall into bad habits just because they are more comfortable.
 
#105
That video is pretty good, but it shows what I always feel about many of the people that use this technique: the right and left hands don't always sound synced up to me. I hear this with Matt Garrison all the time, it is impressive and sounds like a fast flourish, but the individual notes are blurry.

Am I alone in hearing this?
 
#107
Hey dudes,

I'm currently planning my ramp for my p-bass and already figured out what size it will be (7.4x9.0x0.75cm, 12" radius, going from the end of the neck to the Pups), but I have a weird question regarding playing with a ramp - when you hit the string onto the ramp, what kind of sound does it produce? Is it audible at all?
 
#109
Lokire said:
So my question is...do you think there is any benefit to learning 4-finger technique as TRMI TRMI, as opposed to TIMR TIMR? I can imagine that TIMR would be more fluid conceptually, since you're starting with the thumb and moving outward from there. It just seems like it would be so much more work for me personally to reverse the direction I've already taught my 3 fingers to move :p
Click to expand...

I'm way late in replying to this, but anyway...

I'm in pretty much the same boat-I've been experimenting with this technique for the past 6 months or so, and only committed fully to playing that way after getting my Skjold with the ramp/pickup about 3 months ago. I never had the "triplet gallop" issue that Bryan mentioned when I was playing with three fingers, so I've experimented with playing RMIT and TRMI. While I seem to be leaning more in the direction of the former, both seem to be a natural fit with the flow of the RMI three-finger technique.
 
#110
the direction change should only be a problem for a month or so.

When i was in that boat I would always force myself to move my fingers in the TIMR pattern even while not playing, just to solidify the muscle memory. Now my fingers can move in either direction quite fluidly. So it not only aids in the fluidity of the closed palm Garrison technique, but in the end would benefit any other finger style form by breaking you out of the muscle memory plateaus that people fall into.
 
#113
I've been studiously working on the garrison for several months and the thumb seems to be no issue so far.. but getting decent muting has still be plaguing me so I went back to the floating thumb and have begun working on using the pinkie to go with the IMR... its coming along surprisingly well. Anyone else going or gone down that path? With any success?
 
#115
I know some of us have had this discussion elsewhere, but perhaps it is worth reiterating here as well for those who may have missed it.

It is REALLY a shame that this technique is still mistakenly referred to as Matt Garrison's. That is something TBers really should work at getting right, especially since calling it after Garrison credits him for it, and confuses people who are new to the technique about where it came from.

Just as Al Gore didn't invent the Internet, Garrison didn't invent this technique.

From Bass Player Magazine (Feb 05):
"Your four-finger solo technique now seems to be your standard technique in all situations..."

Matt:

"Right—Ive even been using the technique for two-note grooves. Its something I adapted from Gary Willis three-finger approach.... I play a downward thumb pluck and upward plucks with my right-hand index, middle, and ring finger, which are curled underneath; then I mute with the side of my thumb and my left hand."

"How did you develop the scraped string sound you use in your solo on 'I Told Ya So'?"

Matt:

"I got that from Gary Willis. In 2002 we both did a clinic in L.A.; I saw him do it and went, Okay—one more thing to steal from Willis! [Laughs.]"
​
Someone else has also quoted Garrison on the subject, although I don't know where the quote comes from:
"I was looking at the pizzicato techniques that were being used by Dominique Di Piazza, Victor Wooten, Gary Willis, and I came up with a hybrid technique using concepts from all three of these guys." - Garrison
​
This quote is backed up by something Dominique Di Piazza recently posted on youtube:
"HI I just want to add that i started using this technique (thumb, medium and index) in 1979 not know how to use the right hand on the bass ..

"Matt took the idea from me that is what i told me personally, including the tuning of the bass with an high C as well as the chordal playing..

"He came into the [John] McLaughlin group in 1995 after having checking me out throught gigs and video..

"Sometimes it is good to reajust things....

peace
​
Dominique Di piazza"
​
The point is, Matt Garrison uses a pizzicato technique he learned observing other prominent bass players. And this technique was used by players of other instruments long before the electric bass even existed.

Consequently, rather than call it Matt Garrison's technique, we show ourselves better informed to refer to it as a four finger pizzicato, especially given that there are a number of very prominent bass players that use a pizzacato playing technique besides Matthew Garrison, including Hadrien Feraud, Alain Caron, Dominique Di Piazza, and (of course) Bryan Tyler.:p

Just a reminder is all. :D
 
#116
Ammioz77 said:
I've been studiously working on the garrison for several months and the thumb seems to be no issue so far.. but getting decent muting has still be plaguing me so I went back to the floating thumb and have begun working on using the pinkie to go with the IMR... its coming along surprisingly well. Anyone else going or gone down that path? With any success?
Click to expand...
My pinky was really altered due to reconstructive surgery... basketball. I Seriously doubt I could make good use of it as anything other than a help muting strings, and a place to put my wedding ring while I'm playing (so it doesn't bang against frets when it is on my left hand).
 
#117
Dominique emailed me at my website about the same thing once. The problem is- Dominique doesn't pluck that way. He doesn't pluck with his ring. That's as different from using four as Dominique's using three is different from using two as a "standard" bassist does. Neither of them invented anything though (and Matt never claimed to)- both are just variation on classical guitar/banjo plucking. What Gary Willis does is completely different- his is basically a really advanced two-finger plucking that utilizes three fingers. So not only is the way Garrison plucks a little different, but he's the one that brought it to popularity. People were double thumping before Victor Wooten was, but it's not unreasonable to say "double thumping like Wooten does" because he's the one known for it. The title was made as it was years back because Garrison was the only one doing it that was known for doing it.

I'd have no issue with the thread title being changed to "four finger plucking technique" rather than the Matthew Garrison technique. DiPiazza though, as much as I love him as a player and musician, has no more claim to the technique than anyone else, and less so than others as he doesn't pluck with the same number of fingers.

None of it really matters in the end though- who cares how fingers the bassist is using anyways? :p
 
#118
Tom7 said:
I know some of us have had this discussion elsewhere, but perhaps it is worth reiterating here as well for those who may have missed it.

It is REALLY a shame that this technique is still mistakenly referred to as Matt Garrison's. That is something TBers really should work at getting right, especially since calling it after Garrison credits him for it, and confuses people who are new to the technique about where it came from.

Just as Al Gore didn't invent the Internet, Garrison didn't invent this technique.

From Bass Player Magazine (Feb 05):
"Your four-finger solo technique now seems to be your standard technique in all situations..."

Matt:

"Right—Ive even been using the technique for two-note grooves. Its something I adapted from Gary Willis three-finger approach.... I play a downward thumb pluck and upward plucks with my right-hand index, middle, and ring finger, which are curled underneath; then I mute with the side of my thumb and my left hand."

"How did you develop the scraped string sound you use in your solo on 'I Told Ya So'?"

Matt:

"I got that from Gary Willis. In 2002 we both did a clinic in L.A.; I saw him do it and went, Okay—one more thing to steal from Willis! [Laughs.]"
​
Someone else has also quoted Garrison on the subject, although I don't know where the quote comes from:
"I was looking at the pizzicato techniques that were being used by Dominique Di Piazza, Victor Wooten, Gary Willis, and I came up with a hybrid technique using concepts from all three of these guys." - Garrison
​
This quote is backed up by something Dominique Di Piazza recently posted on youtube:
"HI I just want to add that i started using this technique (thumb, medium and index) in 1979 not know how to use the right hand on the bass ..

"Matt took the idea from me that is what i told me personally, including the tuning of the bass with an high C as well as the chordal playing..

"He came into the [John] McLaughlin group in 1995 after having checking me out throught gigs and video..

"Sometimes it is good to reajust things....

peace
​
Dominique Di piazza"
​
The point is, Matt Garrison uses a pizzicato technique he learned observing other prominent bass players. And this technique was used by players of other instruments long before the electric bass even existed.

Consequently, rather than call it Matt Garrison's technique, we show ourselves better informed to refer to it as a four finger pizzicato, especially given that there are a number of very prominent bass players that use a pizzacato playing technique besides Matthew Garrison, including Hadrien Feraud, Alain Caron, Dominique Di Piazza, and (of course) Bryan Tyler.:p

Just a reminder is all. :D
Click to expand...

I knew the minute I sent that, it was going to come back and get me lol.. I will now throw myself to the floor...
 
#119
I should add that another reason I entitled this thread as I did was because the only other four-finger plucking that was being discussed here at TB was the type in which you pluck with your index, middle, ring, and pinky, which was popular amongst a lot of death metal players. Using this title distinguished this thread from those, making it much easier to search out.

I'd still be fine with a title change at this point though.
 
#120
Tom7 said:
My pinky was really altered due to reconstructive surgery... basketball. I Seriously doubt I could make good use of it as anything other than a help muting strings, and a place to put my wedding ring while I'm playing (so it doesn't bang against frets when it is on my left hand).
Click to expand...


Seriously though, thats why I gave up playing ball... (that and to preserve what little bit of knees I have left.)
 
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