Experiences with vocal processors live?

hrodbert696

hrodbert696

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#1
I've kinda already committed, but while I wait for them to arrive, I'm curious what people's experience has been with stompboxes for live vocals. I'm putting an alternative-rock trio together and, for the first time, taking the front man slot, and eager for whatever will help enhance the vocals and fill out the sound. I have a guitarist who should be able to sing some harmonies, but still would like some above-and-beyond.

As it happens, I have two units coming in - a used TC Helicon VoiceLive Play that I'm picking up from a CL seller Monday, and this new TC Helicon "Duplicator" that just came out on order from Sweetwater (I ordered the Duplicator, then the VoiceLive popped up on CL and I figured I'd grab it). Not sure if I'll wind up using both, return the Duplicator to Sweetwater, or maybe pass one or the other on to my guitarist for HIS vox.

I assume no one has used the Duplicator since it seems to be a new product (anyone demo one at NAMM?), but in general - tips, tricks, warnings? Any experiences, any terrible trainwrecks caused by one of these, any ideas for how to best use them? I figure I'll just experiment in the basement with them for a while and see how they work.

Here's the Duplicator link... TC-Helicon Duplicator - Vocal Effects Stompbox
 
#2
the Duplicator is just a doubler effect, meant to thicken your vocals by adding the same part slightly effected as though two people were singing the same thing. There is an octave option too that will add an octave above or below the pitch you are singing at, but won't add harmonies other than the octave.

I have used the Voicelive 2 before in my band settings. It will add harmonies of different types. the voicelive play is just a reduced version of the voicelive 2. It will certainly add harmonies to what you are doing but there will be a learning curve to it. You have to plug your guitar into it to be able to create accurate harmonies in the key you are playing in. Also, getting used to hearing your "corrected" voice in the monitors, especially in ears, takes some getting used to. Can be a helpful tool if you are patient and read up on it, and are also realistic on your expectations.
 
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#3
I had a TC Electronics Harmony-G XT unit; bought it to supplement my lead vox in live situations. I heard it being used quite skillfully by an acquaintance of mine - he was using it so subtley, you didn't quite notice when the harmony vox were being kicked on.

On that strength, I bought one and started incorporating it into my home practice and band rehearsal situations. At home, worked great. In practice, it squealed with feedback every time I tried to use it, regardless of what settings I was using. Never used it live. Quickly put it back in the box never to see the light of day again. I'm sure I could have spent time tweaking it, but didn't make a whole lot of sense to spend the time to do so. Managed to trade it in for some something else not long after I bought it.

One of the guys I'm working with now showed up to a gig with the Boss version of the TC pedal. He plugged it in but didn't tell me - so on top of him kicking in whatever FX he was using, I had his channel eq'd, comped and FX'd already - when he kicked on the pedal it was not good, to say the least. I said, let's work this device in on a rehearsal. Hasn't brought it out to rehearsal yet, so go figure. We also work pretty hard on three part harmonies, so a device like this is redunant to a degree. I think he thinks this is a tool to correct his pitch when he's singing lead. :cautious:

I'm not against the idea of using these types of devices, but subtlety is the key, I think. Also, make sure you test it in the wild before bringing it out on a gig!
 
#4
DirtDog said:
n practice, it squealed with feedback every time I tried to use it, regardless of what settings I was using. Never used it live. Quickly put it back in the box never to see the light of day again. I'm sure I could have spent time tweaking it, but didn't make a whole lot of sense to spend the time to do so.
Click to expand...

I have had the complete opposite experience with one. I use one every Sunday at church, but that is a very low volume setting. I also use it a lot with a bar band I play in and have never experience any feedback or squealing. I also ran FoH for a band this past weekend where one of the vocalists used one on a very loud stage and never had any feedback.

I have heard of other people having issues, but I havent experienced anything negative with mine.

I would highly recommend one if it fits your needs. I personally never liked the effects on the Harmony pedal tho.
 
#5
DirtDog said:
I had a TC Electronics Harmony-G XT unit; bought it to supplement my lead vox in live situations. I heard it being used quite skillfully by an acquaintance of mine - he was using it so subtley, you didn't quite notice when the harmony vox were being kicked on.

On that strength, I bought one and started incorporating it into my home practice and band rehearsal situations. At home, worked great. In practice, it squealed with feedback every time I tried to use it, regardless of what settings I was using. Never used it live. Quickly put it back in the box never to see the light of day again. I'm sure I could have spent time tweaking it, but didn't make a whole lot of sense to spend the time to do so. Managed to trade it in for some something else not long after I bought it.

One of the guys I'm working with now showed up to a gig with the Boss version of the TC pedal. He plugged it in but didn't tell me - so on top of him kicking in whatever FX he was using, I had his channel eq'd, comped and FX'd already - when he kicked on the pedal it was not good, to say the least. I said, let's work this device in on a rehearsal. Hasn't brought it out to rehearsal yet, so go figure. We also work pretty hard on three part harmonies, so a device like this is redunant to a degree. I think he thinks this is a tool to correct his pitch when he's singing lead. :cautious:

I'm not against the idea of using these types of devices, but subtlety is the key, I think. Also, make sure you test it in the wild before bringing it out on a gig!
Click to expand...

I have only experience with the MicMechanic from TC. It has a kind of high frequency boost, but you can turn it off. But that's not obvious. Some dynamic vocal mics already have a kind of presence enhancer/high frequency boost built in. In combination this leads to feedback orgies...
I like the MicMechanic a lot. Maybe other TC products have the same high frequency boost.
 
#6
I have used both the Harmony-G and the VL2.
The G works well for basic harmonies [when used judiciously] but does require a guitar input to trigger things.
If you don't play guitar, you can send a feed (split) from the guitar player into it.
The VL2 is far more expansive (and expensive), and EXTREMELY customizable; can be run based on chosen key, chromatically or triggered externally; can have multiple step harmonies per song and so on. Awesome device for a lead singer.
The Harmony G (XT) will do for most live situations I encountered.
 
#7
I have a TC Helicon VoiceSynth. I use it live often enough but it's an effect, in the real sense. It has pitch correction, but I turn it up real high and kind of "play" the synth with my voice.

Anyway, I find the biggest issue is volume. I can't seem to be able to get the effected and uneffected sounds to remain at unity consistently. One day it works, the next it's a P.i.t.a.
 
#9
like most soundguys i despise those things.

delay, verb and compression are best done at the mixer where they can be balanced to actually sound right in the mix and more importantly kept out of the monitors. i've had to mix more than one band where the lead singer insisted on one of these, so the other guys' backups were all loud and clear while the lead vocal was a distorted, murky mess.

the right way to use it is to send a dry and an effected signal out front so they can be mixed properly and so the dry signal can be sent back to the monitor.

the one time i did enjoy mixing a band that used them was because they were using the crap out of them, creating a deliberately "effected" and autotuned vocal sound that was halfway to a synthesizer. it perfectly fit the sort of "dream-pop" vibe the band was going for.

if you're just trying to get good-sounding "normal" vocals, there are better methods.
 
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#11
Yes, less is better. Be discrete. Anything more than some careful EQ, compression and/or reverb/echo can sound pretty synthetic. Unless that is what you are going for... I can't stand some of those auto-tuned pop hits.
I only use some EQ and boost, plus a bit of slap-back echo on leads. But I do like the tight thirds harmony, or extra unison voices, when singing backups. It really helps fill out the band's vocals.
But don't overdo it. People want to hear YOU, not some machine.
 
#13
I use the TC Helicon Harmony Singer. Run Guitar signal through it. I use 3rd and 5th above setting. Step on for harmonies, step off no harmonies. Avoids the forgot to turn off effects problem. I even get compliments from house sound techs. I have heard other club bands using the Voice Live Touch and they had very natural sounding Boston and Journey harmonies.
 
#14
The singer in one band I subbed in for a few shows had one to add some harmonies on a slick, west-coast style soft funk tune. It actually sounded really great, maybe too good, because the effect were almost like a parody of that 80's sound. We (the band) couldn't help but laughing, which kind of reduced the impact of the lyrics... Even though we apologized afterwards, the pedal was never used again.
 
#15
Doug R said:
Anything more than some careful EQ, compression and/or reverb/echo can sound pretty synthetic. Unless that is what you are going for.
Click to expand...
never use the compression unless you can get a dry vocal back into your monitors!

compressed vocals in the monitors is a quick road to feeding back wedges and to blown out voices from over-singing.
 
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#16
I use the Boss VE-2 on my board because it allows you to specify a key, harmony interval and wet dry balance for the effect. It also lets you turn off all of the enhancement and autotune stuff on my natural voice sound. I generally set the effect harmony much softer than my own voice and ONLY use it when I am singing backup parts. We tried it and my guitarists unit as a substitute for harmony singers and it was too synthetic. What we have found though is that (with the correct key set) the harmony the Boss produces will be pitch correct even if I am a few cents off. That allows myself and anyone else doing backups to have a pitch reference. So, even though it is much softer than the part I am singing, it really tightens up what we are all doing when I kick it on.

...and yeah...you have to turn it off before you say anything between songs.
 
#17
Joe Smithberger said:
What we have found though is that (with the correct key set) the harmony the Boss produces will be pitch correct even if I am a few cents off. That allows myself and anyone else doing backups to have a pitch reference. So, even though it is much softer than the part I am singing, it really tightens up what we are all doing when I kick it on.
Click to expand...
that's something i've always wondered about, if a box like this could be used with its autotune just as a vocal pitch guide, fed back into the monitors only at low levels to "steer" pitchy singers.
 
#19
With the Digitech Live 2 you can take the mixed output through a single XLR to the main mixer and dial in the balance between your original vocal and the treated signal right on the pedal. You can send mixed or all digitized through that output, however you balance them on the knob.
But there are also a pair of 1/4" output jacks that can be used separately to isolate the straight vocal from the treated. You can send them to the board as a stereo output (normal + harmony) or you could send that pitch-corrected unison output wherever you want it. That would work if you want to just send the corrected output to your monitor. Not sure you'd want to though... Better to hear the corrected voice with your own vocal together so you can hear them clash if you get out of pitch. It wouldn't be good to think you're right on and have just your off-pitch vocal go out front while your monitor sounds like you're in tune!
 
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