How to approach bass lessons

[SteveLo42]

It’s interesting to me that EVERYONE replying in this thread is completely ignoring this statement.
For many adult learners on bass, wrist problems BEGIN when first learning the instrument on their own. The first thing that any teacher should address when teaching a beginner is posture and hand position to reduce tension on the wrist.
Often, when teaching kids, these instructions can “loosen” over time as hand and shoulder strength builds. A musician who is starting as an adult has an advantage because they have already developed hand strength and coordination (especially a drummer!). However, tendons also thicken and become less flexible over time, raising the spectre of problems such as tennis elbow.
It occurs to me that you might have come up with some novel ways of navigating challenging music (while nursing an injury) without the benefit of basic instruction. These are usually known colloquially as “bad habits”.
If your injury is still bothering you after three years, you may have to do excercises away from the bass to try to conform with what your teacher expects of you in terms of posture and approach.
Obviously, your teacher is probably not an expert on these matters. It might be helpful to consult a physical therapist, chiropractor, Alexander technique instructor, etc.
Of course, this is all speculation. Without video, or hearing from your teacher, nobody can say what’s REALLY going on. But I’m guessing it probably has to do with the accommodations you have made for yourself on the instrument.

Thanks!
You're pretty much spot on. I play in a way that is comfortable for my wrist, but that means I have to stretch a lot with my fingers and it seems I'm not fretting properly so my sound is sloppy. I'm going to crack on with the lessons and follow my teacher's advice (I think I scared him quite a bit with my inury!), but if it happens that the pain increases - which so far it hasn't - I will have to revert to what's comfortable, or compromise between the two.

I've actually just finished a series of 6 physio sessions today, and have exercises that I am doing daily for the wrist. Fingers crossed they will make some difference over time.

 

[SteveCS]

It’s interesting to me that EVERYONE replying in this thread is completely ignoring this statement.
...
without the benefit of basic instruction.
...
Obviously, your teacher is probably not an expert on these matters.

Not quite sure how you reached that conclusion. After 40 years without pain or injury of any sort the benefits of good technique are as plain and obvious to me as the nose on my face. It is also seemingly obvious to this teacher, since that is the first thing s/he focussed in on for the OP. Provided they really are teaching a good left hand (and not some half-baked version of it) there is no need for any of us to labour the point any further.

YMMV

 

[Geogio]

There is truth to the statement that when you first start out on an instrument you're basically taking instrument familiarity lessons, coupled with technique as in posture, finger drills, cross string drills, fretting drills,.. and a lot of it is covered in various places. I used to use Carl Culpepper's 101 terrifying techniques for guitar. It works on bass too and although it's pick oriented it really covers a lot of intervalic stuff and some other things that might come in handy as you start plucking your way around on your instrument. If you're sitting around you ought to start plucking with your fingers, use three fingers ring middle index (RMI) in that order over and over and over again shifting Frets as you get better with each note.

I'm sure as a drummer you can drum with your fingers on both hands and those are good strengthening exercises on a tabletop kind of like a drum pad except each finger is a drumstick.

Look up Carol Kaye on YouTube. She does this video on how to make your metronome swing. It's an amazing video because the metronome actually starts swinging even though it's mechanical and it's doing one beat at a time... when you get the groove going with your fingers the metronome actually sounds like it's got some syncopation to it! That's an important video to watch and I highly recommend that.

Keep in mind that you're still in the Rhythm Section!

Warmest regards as you endeavour to persevere!

 

[klyph]

I think I scared him quite a bit with my inury!

It is also seemingly obvious to this teacher

Just because you know what the finish line looks like, doesn’t mean you know how to get there. Just because YOU think there’s some sort of obvious retort, doesn’t mean “end of thread”.
Nobody cares how long you’ve been playing without injury. You didn’t start this thread, you don’t work in therapy or recovery. Why are you trying to shut down commentary? Why are you discouraging consulting a medical professional? What is wrong with you?
People get traumatic injuries all the time that they have to work around. That might involve some unorthodox approaches. Some might cause other injuries, some won’t.

One approach that works for interpersonal discourse is to think with your brain before using your mouth or fingers. You might want to try it. Especially if you want to “labour” this any further.

 

[Lee Moses]

One approach that works for interpersonal discourse is to think with your brain before using your mouth or fingers.

Good idea. Try it.

 

[SteveLo42]

Just because you know what the finish line looks like, doesn’t mean you know how to get there. Just because YOU think there’s some sort of obvious retort, doesn’t mean “end of thread”.
Nobody cares how long you’ve been playing without injury. You didn’t start this thread, you don’t work in therapy or recovery. Why are you trying to shut down commentary? Why are you discouraging consulting a medical professional? What is wrong with you?
People get traumatic injuries all the time that they have to work around. That might involve some unorthodox approaches. Some might cause other injuries, some won’t.

One approach that works for interpersonal discourse is to think with your brain before using your mouth or fingers. You might want to try it. Especially if you want to “labour” this any further.

Eh?

 

[SteveCS]

Just because you know what the finish line looks like, doesn’t mean you know how to get there. Just because YOU think there’s some sort of obvious retort, doesn’t mean “end of thread”.
Nobody cares how long you’ve been playing without injury. You didn’t start this thread, you don’t work in therapy or recovery. Why are you trying to shut down commentary? Why are you discouraging consulting a medical professional? What is wrong with you?
People get traumatic injuries all the time that they have to work around. That might involve some unorthodox approaches. Some might cause other injuries, some won’t.

One approach that works for interpersonal discourse is to think with your brain before using your mouth or fingers. You might want to try it. Especially if you want to “labour” this any further.

Ooh, someone's a bit touchy tonight. I would never shut down these conversations nor would I ever discourage anyone from seeking professional medical advice where appropriate. You're the one that cast doubt on the teacher without any real evidence to back your claim. Maybe the teacher is no good as a music teacher. But if the first thing s/he focussed on was helping the OP fix or avoid bad or potentially dangerous or injurious technique then they get a plus point from me. Even if they teach nothing else, how can that be a bad thing? After all, they are the only one to have had actual first-hand sight of any limitations imposed by the injury.

 

[SteveLo42]

I'm lost. But I am a bit drunk. Chill, its all good.

 

[klyph]

I’m sure we’re probably more in agreement than not.


The OP had an injury that stopped him from playing his main instrument. One that might even be visible in casual contact. One that he’s been dealing with for three years. That sounds to me like a pretty serious injury. So… maybe an appropriate response might take that into consideration. Somehow, when I did that in my reply, you found it objectionable. You then took me to task by cherry-picking portions of sentences out of context. “Without the benefit of instruction “ was BEFORE he started taking lessons. “Excercises away from the bass” are the matters upon which the teacher might not be an “expert “in. Experts upon that would be the professionals I mentioned previously. In other words, there are aspects in his particular situation that his teacher might not be able to assist him with. I really don’t understand why you had a problem with me saying this.

Maybe you haven’t had to deal with these sorts of problems in your musical life. I speak from personal experience. My playing wasn’t affected, but a massive coronary a year ago took away my ability to sing completely (I could barely talk). I’ve been gigging steadily, but no microphone until very recently. I had to go through a rehab program for several months just to get to this point where my lungs could handle it. NOW I’m ready to find a vocal coach (it would have been wasted money before now). But I still need to continue with the therapies and exercises that have nothing to do with singing (obviously).

I was simply offering encouragement and hoping that there are people around he can consult besides his teacher. I was in no way casting any doubts on his teacher. Nothing in his commentary would lead me to do that (as you pointed out).

 

[SteveLo42]

Do you think being able to play the intro to Tarkus by ELP is a realistic goal? Or the whole song ,even? That would certainly make me very happy.

 

[klyph]

Do you think being able to play the intro to Tarkus by ELP is a realistic goal? Or the whole song ,even? That would certainly make me very happy.

That really just depends on the timeline, I think. The frustrating thing about bass is that (as you are discovering) basic tone production, in and of itself, is work. Scales or exercises need to be done slowly to build up endurance, so you can play fluidly with good tone BEFORE starting to speed up. Once you’re over the hurdle of making the notes sound good, getting faster will seem easy in comparison.
Playing like Greg Lake- an admirable goal! I’ll be honest , it might be a year or two of solid work to even begin pulling off those licks. However, you may surprise yourself! You’ll definitely have full functionality in your wrist by the time you achieve that goal, for sure.

 

[SteveCS]

I’m sure we’re probably more in agreement than not.
...

That is invariably the case in text-based forums

...
The frustrating thing about bass is that ... basic tone production, in and of itself, is work. Scales or exercises need to be done slowly to build up endurance, so you can play fluidly with good tone
...

And on this we can 100% agree

 

[mambo4]

Bass lessons startle easily, approach them slowly without any sudden moves, from downwind.