IEM with Ambient Microphone Only

#21
Stewy Lj said:
I just did this last week at rehearsal. Problem was cymbals drowned out everything.
Click to expand...
so in other words it sounded like it does on stage :)
Joe Smithberger said:
...a little battery powered stereo condenser microphone for stage sound.
Click to expand...
see, now i'm imagining that mic connected to a stereo wireless pack of some sort and hung on you, like on your shirt or something. you could walk around the stage and hear things like you would with your ears, including left-right balance as you turned around and loudness as you got closer or further.

it would be like walking around hearing the stage sound, just quieter.
 
#22
or even better, check these things out!
55cc17af4b2f2ca100b5c9aedb8dc3c7_original.png

"Here" bionic ears

little self-contained earphones with mics right on them!

you can hear just like normal, but turn everything down (via smartphone app).

the initial concept has a few dumb features like an option to add reverb, but the idea is pretty cool.

soundguys would hate having to go back to dragging out wedges, but players who like wedges and stage volume could have it back, but be able to turn it all down.
 
Last edited:
#23
walterw said:
now i'm imagining that mic connected to a stereo wireless pack of some sort and hung on you, like on your shirt or something. you could walk around the stage and hear things like you would with your ears, including left-right balance as you turned around and loudness as you got closer or further.

it would be like walking around hearing the stage sound, just quieter.
Click to expand...

Your body would create unnatural shadows in the sound. Having a couple of miniature mics mounted on each side of your head would give more of a true binaural sound, but to be honest I don't think you want the sound changing as you move around. Instead, I think a feed from the mixer, one mic on the right side of the drumset, and one mic on the left side of the drum set might be the best way to go. Or possibly off stage left and right (wings) aimed back at the other instruments, which would reduce the bleed from the drums and cymbals. The bass will come direct through the Rolls; so if possible, it might be best to aim the ambient mics to minimize bleed from the bass amp.
 
Last edited:
#24
Is the Alesis unit functioning as a preamp for the mic?
I can't imagine not getting a direct feed from the mixer for the vocals. I do a lot of harmony vocals, so that kind of dry sound is important to me for precision.
If you have an available pre-fader aux send, you can plug in your ambient mic to your front of house mixer. Then send an aux feed to your Rolls unit with direct vocals plus ambient mic. this would free up your ambient mic to be pointed more directly at the guitar and keyboard amps.
 
#25
I've done it this way, but moved away from it for many of the reasons stated and some others. Mic placement is key as well as the mic choice. Placement is your only control over balance. If you only rehearse in the same room and never gig, this will probably be fine. All the work of mic placement, etc and you might find its easier to steal each signal with a cheap DI (and vox from a console aux) and get yourself a tiny little 4 ch mixer. Are you saying they won't 'allow' you place a DI in their signal chains?
 
#26
skidmarkbass said:
I sometimes rehearse with a very loud guitarist and keyboard player. No one goes thru the PA except the singer. I am thinking of using my Rolls PM351 with an Ambient microphone ONLY. I have tested it at home playing along with the stereo and it seems to work fine. I want to try it in a rehearsal situation to control volume to MY EARS. Has anyone tried this? I know that IEMs will sound best when everyone goes thru the PA, however that will probably NEVER happen with this project.
View attachment 853543
Click to expand...

Doing it right this time

it's a long story, but it could help you out a bit just to see how we are doing. on the side note, i've got so much more stuff going on in the band i didn't update the thread
 
#27
Just a thought - but if the problem is just volume - why not use the IEMs as ear plugs to reduce the level, but then just add you into the mix to give the clarity to your own input to the 'whole'. If they're that loud, then you'll still hear the same balance in the room, just quieter and a bit duller - then just perk yourself up for tuning and pleasantness! Forget about a mix, just something you can work with.
 
#30
You folks that have tried this - where did you place the mic? Sure you have no control over the mix, but he didn't already. I'd expect a mic very close to your head to be closest to what you would normally hear, but that's just intuition.
 
#32
swarfrat said:
You folks that have tried this - where did you place the mic? Sure you have no control over the mix, but he didn't already. I'd expect a mic very close to your head to be closest to what you would normally hear, but that's just intuition.
Click to expand...

Seems intuitive but microphones do not have the same frequency response as your ears. And every microphone has a different frequency response from the next.
 
#33
swarfrat said:
You folks that have tried this - where did you place the mic? Sure you have no control over the mix, but he didn't already. I'd expect a mic very close to your head to be closest to what you would normally hear, but that's just intuition.
Click to expand...

Through mic placement you do have some control over the mix, which is further enhanced if you use a mixer to control the levels. IHMO the worst option will be to place the mic near your head. Yes this may be closest to what you would hear in the band, but the goal should be to improve what you hear rather than simply reduce the volume.
 
#35
Joe Smithberger said:
My stereo mic is placed just off the floor about 5 feet in front of the kick drum. The X-Y mics are kind aimed at the guitar amps, behind any floor wedges. It probably wouldnt work as well if I was off to one side. It also helps that we have a pretty good instrument mix on stage between bass, drums, and two guitars.
Click to expand...

The placement you mention sounds pretty good if you only need to capture instruments on one side of the drummer. Placing the mics near the floor will capture more of the low end of the drum set and deemphasize the cymbals a bit. Additionally if the mic is essentially on the floor I believe this helps reduce phase problems. Because the mics are aimed towards the guitar amps, you further reduce the sound of the drum set because it is somewhat off axis from the mics. One problem is placing a mic 5 feet in front of the drum set can restrict movement around the stage, especially on small stages. Additionally if you need to capture an instrument on the other side of the stage you are out of luck.

Having two mono mics offstage left and offstage right also has potential advantages and disadvantages. The most obvious is you can capture instruments on both sides of the drummer and the mics are not on stage where they may serve as barriers to free movement of the entertainers. Additionally placing the mics further from the drum set can deemphasize the entire kit...which could be good or bad.

Basically the OP will need to experiment to find the best mix. The key is to learn to predict what happens you move the mics around so you can strike a compromise that is closest to your ideal mix. As we all like a different mix, what works for the OP may not work for the next person.
 
#36
swarfrat said:
I kinda meant as a starting point. Obviously, feel free to relocate to mix.
Click to expand...

For all I know, a mic next to your head may be the best solution for your needs. Just trying to help everyone see potential options for using mic placement to give them more of what they want to hear.

Something to consider, is just because a mic is plugged into a mixer does not mean it has to be sent to front of house. If the OP's band has a mixer that has unused input channels and a pair of pre fader auxes, these could easily be used to create a generic stereo mix that any of the band members could use for IEM purposes. A Rolls PM351 could be used by everyone to balance their instrument and vocal mic against the stereo mix.
 
Last edited:
#37
Another thing to be aware of is that the PM351 directly into your ear buds has no limiting for ear protection. The pm55p has limiting but fewer channels - stereo monitor in and an xlr microphone in. No big deal if you are feeding a wireless unit but if you are using a combo cord like me (headphone extension + guitar cable) and running wired, it may be a concern.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back