Just when I thought it was safe to go back into the water....Cabinet related

E

ezra1

Jun 7, 2009
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Behind the Pine Curtain
#1
OK, I have a 2002 Ashdown EVO 500 on the way....It is 4 ohm
I already have a Ashdown 410T rated 450 watts at 8 ohms.
I was thinking maybe I should pick up a Ashdown Rootmaster 410 T that is specked at 450 watts @ 8 ohms and use both cabs with the 500 watt 4 ohm head.
A sales guy at Sweetwater told me that I don't want to do that unless I get a more powerful amplifier.
That I need to just use one 410 @ 8 ohm cabinet.
I am confused.... Help please.
 
#7
ezra1 said:
As long as I am asking questions, would a Peavey Headliner 410 work ?
They are 8 ohm but good for1600 watts.
Could I use it and my Ashdown 410 together ?
Click to expand...

Yes, you could, BUT

There could be phase issues or other unpleasant sounds using different cabs.

The power handling rating isn't a concern as long as it's higher than your amplifier. Your main concerns are ohms, which you seem to understand, and tone, which I don't think you know what you want.

You're suggesting different cab brand/model combinations, but why? Do you need more volume? One bass heavy cab, and another treble heavy cab doesn't immediately equal a combo that covers everything well.

Wait and see how your head sounds with the cab you have, before you try theorizing the sound of a multitude of head/cab combinations through words on the computer ;)
 
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#8
I don't know if the guy at Sweet water made a mistake or just needed to make a sale to get some commission. If it's a mistake the guy should not be selling gear.

Bassicaly, Your amp can handle two 8 ohm cabs or one 4 ohm cab.
 
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#9
blubass said:
Yes, you could, BUT

There could be phase issues or other unpleasant sounds using different cabs.

The power handling rating isn't a concern as long as it's higher than your amplifier. Your main concerns are ohms, which you seem to understand, and tone, which I don't think you know what you want.

You're suggesting different cab brand/model combinations, but why? Do you need more volume? One bass heavy cab, and another treble heavy cab doesn't immediately equal a combo that covers everything well.

Wait and see how your head sounds with the cab you have, before you try theorizing the sound of a multitude of head/cab combinations through words on the computer ;)
Click to expand...
blubass said:
Yes, you could, BUT

There could be phase issues or other unpleasant sounds using different cabs.

The power handling rating isn't a concern as long as it's higher than your amplifier. Your main concerns are ohms, which you seem to understand, and tone, which I don't think you know what you want.

You're suggesting different cab brand/model combinations, but why? Do you need more volume? One bass heavy cab, and another treble heavy cab doesn't immediately equal a combo that covers everything well.

Wait and see how your head sounds with the cab you have, before you try theorizing the sound of a multitude of head/cab combinations through words on the computer ;)
Click to expand...
Just being kind of cheap man....I can pay less for the Peavey..And I know what to do if they were out of phase with each other.
As for as visual aesetics the Ashdown would be the best and probably the best match.
 
#10
ezra1 said:
Just being kind of cheap man....I can pay less for the Peavey..And I know what to do if they were out of phase with each other.
As for as visual aesetics the Ashdown would be the best and probably the best match.
Click to expand...

We are not talking about a polarity issue, but rather a phasing issue between the different cabs response curves. And you cannot fix that by changing wiring.
 
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#17
ezra1 said:
OK, I have a 2002 Ashdown EVO 500 on the way....It is 4 ohm
I already have a Ashdown 410T rated 450 watts at 8 ohms.
I was thinking maybe I should pick up a Ashdown Rootmaster 410 T that is specked at 450 watts @ 8 ohms and use both cabs with the 500 watt 4 ohm head.
A sales guy at Sweetwater told me that I don't want to do that unless I get a more powerful amplifier.
That I need to just use one 410 @ 8 ohm cabinet.
I am confused.... Help please.
Click to expand...

get a second bass head and daisy chain the amps
 
#18
Ric5 said:
get a second bass head and daisy chain the amps
Click to expand...

I believe this is likely to result in an amplifier shutdown at best, and a major repair bill at worst.

My understanding is that each amplifier would see the output impedance of the other amplifier in parallel with the speaker's impedance. Since the output impedance of most amplifiers is a small fraction of an ohm, each amplifier would be seeing something pretty close to a dead short. That is not good for amplifier output stages.

I do not know what the consequence of both amplifiers putting out power simultaneously would be, but don't think that's likely to make things any better.

EDIT: In retrospect, I think I misunderstood Ric5's suggestion. See Digital Man's post just below.
 
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#19
DukeLeJeune said:
I believe this is likely to result in an amplifier shutdown at best, and a major repair bill at worst.

My understanding is that each amplifier would see the output impedance of the other amplifier in parallel with the speaker's impedance. Since the output impedance of most amplifiers is a small fraction of an ohm, each amplifier would be seeing something pretty close to a dead short. That is not good for amplifier output stages.

I do not know what the consequence of both amplifiers putting out power simultaneously would be, but don't think that's likely to make things any better.
Click to expand...
I think he meant one head per cab.
 
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#20
ezra1 said:
OK, I have a 2002 Ashdown EVO 500 on the way....It is 4 ohm
I already have a Ashdown 410T rated 450 watts at 8 ohms.
I was thinking maybe I should pick up a Ashdown Rootmaster 410 T that is specked at 450 watts @ 8 ohms and use both cabs with the 500 watt 4 ohm head.
A sales guy at Sweetwater told me that I don't want to do that unless I get a more powerful amplifier.
That I need to just use one 410 @ 8 ohm cabinet.
I am confused.... Help please.
Click to expand...

The sales guy is right - the EVO head won't put out the full 575 watts into 8ohms so won't blow your existing 410 unless you dime it for hours on end so need for another cab unless you particularly want one.

My experience of the Rootmaster cabs is that they are not overly efficient so you will not have a matched response if your existing cab is an ABM. It will work just fine of course but probably won't sound as good as the single ABM cab. Two cabs will look much more impressive though :)
 
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