Side dots on fretless are not quite in the right position - any ideas?

[john m]

I have an unlined fretless with side dots aligned to the “frets.” Intonated the bass as best as possible using the fingertips of my pinky (12th fret and 12th fret harmonics) but when I play with my finger on the dot I’m always sharp by a fair amount. I’m testing this with the tip of my pinky finger. To play a low G in tune, I need to press over 1/8” before the dot.

Is it simply the case the dots were installed in the wrong position? Or is there potentially something wrong with my setup?

Relief is 0.011”. Action is 4/64” on G/D/A and 5/64” on E.

I’m using a chromatic tuner. My only strobe is an iOS app and it works poorly, always bouncing between sharp and flat when I play a note.

I have owned fretless basses where the dot was “at the fret” not “at the space”.
DB’s are marked that way.

 

[J-Bass RMR]

Little late to the game - but:

If you are measuring with a straight edge butted up to the nut (a tape measure could skew the result) and the octave markers are at 17.25; (intentionally or not) at the end of the day, it's a 34 /12" scale bass.
This in of itself is not a problem as long as 1) the bridge allows adequate saddle "travel" to intonate the bass, and, 2) you're not bothered by the slightly longer scale length. (which, IMO - would be hard for most to perceive)

With the octave marker at 17.25", the (inside) measurement from the nut to the bridge plate should be a minimum of 35 1/2" to allow for adequate saddle adjustment.
I'm curious to know what that measurement is on your bass?
I'm guessing the bridge was placed for a 34" scale, or ~35" from nut to the bridge plate.
(and since you have intonated it the average saddle center is currently close to 34 3/4"? (which of course can vary with string type)

If this is indeed the case, at that point, if it were my bass (purchase used and not returnable):
IF there is room, I would at least move the existing bridge back as far as I could without exposing the front mounting holes, and replace those saddles with some threaded ones.
Or first research other bridges they may allow for longer saddle travel. Either way, I'd drill new holes and re-position the bridge.

 

[Stagelab]

Little late to the game - but:

If you are measuring with a straight edge butted up to the nut (a tape measure could skew the result) and the octave markers are at 17.25; (intentionally or not) at the end of the day, it's a 34 /12" scale bass.
This in of itself is not a problem as long as 1) the bridge allows adequate saddle "travel" to intonate the bass, and, 2) you're not bothered by the slightly longer scale length. (which, IMO - would be hard for most to perceive)

With the octave marker at 17.25", the (inside) measurement from the nut to the bridge plate should be a minimum of 35 1/2" to allow for adequate saddle adjustment.
I'm curious to know what that measurement is on your bass?
I'm guessing the bridge was placed for a 34" scale, or ~35" from nut to the bridge plate.
(and since you have intonated it the average saddle center is currently close to 34 3/4"? (which of course can vary with string type)

If this is indeed the case, at that point, if it were my bass (purchase used and not returnable):
IF there is room, I would at least move the existing bridge back as far as I could without exposing the front mounting holes, and replace those saddles with some threaded ones.
Or first research other bridges they may allow for longer saddle travel. Either way, I'd drill new holes and re-position the bridge.

What part of the bridge plate should I measure to?

I’ve removed the bridge and am planning to move it back, like you said. Other option I found is getting a Hipshot A style.

After swapping the bridge, I’d rather have this set up as a 34”. If I conceal the side dots, intonate the bass at the 17” mark (octave for a 34” scale), and then apply new side dots (I have sticker inlays), would that work out? Or will this cause other issues?

 

[J-Bass RMR]

What part of the bridge plate should I measure to?

See photos below; I used my lined fretless because it's easier to illustrate the Octave "marker" is at 17".
None of my unlined fretless necks have the side-dot octave mark at over 17". (Tony Franlins are 16 7/8)
On every 34" scale FS) I have the (inside) measurement nut to bridge plate is ~35" (+/-) (35 1/8" in the photo below)

 

[J-Bass RMR]

I’d rather have this set up as a 34”. If I conceal the side dots, intonate the bass at the 17” mark (octave for a 34” scale), and then apply new side dots (I have sticker inlays), would that work out? Or will this cause other issues?

How's it playing now that you have it intonated?

Stickers and inlays are a "work-around" - I'd call it a cobble-job, and I mean that in the best possible sense.
And if you were to re-mark it as a 34" scale - there would be no reason to replace the bridge... (but do something with those saddles)

But IF the octave mark actually is at 17 1/4" I'd just accept the bass for what it is and reposition the bridge
A few extra holes never hurt anything (photo), and yours would be covered up. (and wouldn't you have to drill for inlays anyway??)
That would be the "proper" fix, IMO.

 

[bassdude51]

I only read page 1.

It's impossible to perfectly intonate a fretless bass. It's impossible to note a perfect intonated note with our fingers.

It's a fretless and it sounds the way that it does because the notes are never perfect. It's normal and it is the reason a fretless bass sounds like a fretless bass.

Enjoy it!

 

[Stagelab]

How's it playing now that you have it intonated?

Stickers and inlays are a "work-around" - I'd call it a cobble-job, and I mean that in the best possible sense.
And if you were to re-mark it as a 34" scale - there would be no reason to replace the bridge... (but do something with those saddles)

But IF the octave mark actually is at 17 1/4" I'd just accept the bass for what it is and reposition the bridge
A few extra holes never hurt anything (photo), and yours would be covered up. (and wouldn't you have to drill for inlays anyway??)
That would be the "proper" fix, IMO.


View attachment 7027422

You think if I repositioned the dots I wouldn’t need to move the bridge? I have a hunch the saddles would still be crooked. I was thinking of moving the bridge and repositioning the dots, allowing me to move the saddles much further forward, which will straighten the saddles and string end angles.

 

[sissy kathy]

You think if I repositioned the dots I wouldn’t need to move the bridge? I have a hunch the saddles would still be crooked. I was thinking of moving the bridge and repositioning the dots, allowing me to move the saddles much further forward, which will straighten the saddles and string end angles.

You managed to get it intonated with the bridge in its present location. In reality you don't need to do anything but play it. There's a young lady of 13 years that plays 34 scale basses, surely you as an adult can manage another inch of neck. If you lift the neck about a foot you'll discover how much closer the F is.

EllenPlaysBass

12-year-old bass player from Las Vegas, Nevada. Started playing the bass in April 2020. The journey continues ... Official Website: www.EllenPlaysBass.com Contact: [email protected]

www.youtube.com

 

[Stagelab]

You managed to get it intonated with the bridge in its present location. In reality you don't need to do anything but play it. There's a young lady of 13 years that plays 34 scale basses, surely you as an adult can manage another inch of neck. If you lift the neck about a foot you'll discover how much closer the F is.

EllenPlaysBass

12-year-old bass player from Las Vegas, Nevada. Started playing the bass in April 2020. The journey continues ... Official Website: www.EllenPlaysBass.com Contact: [email protected]

www.youtube.com

Thanks, I’m aware of Ellen. She’s great. While I can play a 34.5” and used to play a 35”, I don’t want to now. This is my choice.