The Hal Leonard Bass Method thread

[SteveCS]

Hey everybody, just checking in again to say hi, and thank you for all of the enthusiastic support of this work. I feel very proud of the method, it represents a lot of time and thought on my part, and it is heartening to see so many people using it, and getting better.

Hey Ed., I didn't learn from this book because the 2nd edition was not around when I started (1983). I think the first edition was, but I plumped for the Chuck Rainey 'Complete Electric Bass Player' series instead, just because it was available. My point is that I've seen several questions about things in the book recently so decided I needed a reference copy for my library. Since getting hold of the 'Complete' edition a few weeks ago I've read through and have already recommended it to several new players and I can see why, 20 years on, it is rightly becoming a trusted 'staple' work.

 

[KindofBlues71]

So for those of you with the Easy/More Easy/Even More Easy song books, you recommend using them side by side with each Method book? Is there a section of each Method book that we should start using the song books, or start them both at the same time?

What other bass instruction books do you guys have? I'll list mine below with the order I think I should use them but if someone has a recommendation I'm all ears.

Complete Bass Method Book - Friedland
Rhythm and Counting - Harrison
Time and Groove for Bass Guitar - Wolfe
Complete Fingerstyle Bass Technique - Hawkins
Creative Bass Technique Exercises - Hawkins
Million Dollar Bass Lines - Wolfe
Soul Fingers: Music & Life of Legendary Bassist Donald "Duck" Dunn - Rosaci

Any recommended books I'm missing?

 

[EddiePlaysBass]

@KindofBlues71 I personally get a lot out of the Bass Aerobics book, as well as the Walking Jazz Lines For Bass one. YMMV.

 

[SteveCS]

So for those of you with the Easy/More Easy/Even More Easy song books, you recommend using them side by side with each Method book? Is there a section of each Method book that we should start using the song books, or start them both at the same time?

What other bass instruction books do you guys have? I'll list mine below with the order I think I should use them but if someone has a recommendation I'm all ears.

Complete Bass Method Book - Friedland
Rhythm and Counting - Harrison
Time and Groove for Bass Guitar - Wolfe
Complete Fingerstyle Bass Technique - Hawkins
Creative Bass Technique Exercises - Hawkins
Million Dollar Bass Lines - Wolfe
Soul Fingers: Music & Life of Legendary Bassist Donald "Duck" Dunn - Rosaci

Any recommended books I'm missing?

Here's a few I've collected over the years:

 

[NotAGardener]

Method Book 1, pg 22, Crossin’ Three, age….closer to 70 than I’d prefer. I’ve played Crossin’ Three nearer 100 times than 50; if a counter indicated more than 200 I wouldn’t argue.

At this point I don’t need to read the score to hit the notes and keep the overall tempo but I’m not terribly satisfied. Dynamically my plucking can vary quite a bit but at least my left hand fingers generally hit the strings where desired. Not always but mostly. My floating thumb or movable anchor, it varies between the two and not by design, differs in effectiveness at moving & muting but is getting better; I still have to think about it. Left hand muting? While I mute via some fingerings, others are not so good but it’ll get there and that maybe due to overload in other areas.

When I’m reading the score + playing, which seems a good exercise from several perspectives, fretting fingers err more, much more for #4 and particular string combinations (C to E on E string being a favorite mashup) and I’m perfectly capable of making a more universal mess of it sometimes...usually on the second pass after a successful first. Of course sometimes it’s a train wrecks due to momentary loss of concentration or not thinking ahead but that’s...whatever. Concentrate and think ahead, better.

I guess this is all to say and hopefully get confirmation that getting to the point that your fretting fingers intrinsically know exactly where to go, you don’t launch into the weeds and just flub the LZ (landing zone) more than you’d like, and your plucking fingers deliver consistent dynamics, can be a very long journey. I mean, like many here I’m sure, I’ve done lotsa mental/physical sporting, thrill seeking, dynamic stuff, much of which can get you killed (or worse) but nothing as small scale, delicate, intricate and demanding as this. So: Am I an outlier or is this just really devilishly hard and slow, particularly when your, well, if not yet on the final approach of a life, definitely in the descent phase and nearing the landing pattern?

Cheers, and thanks for any insights.

 

[rinchenuker]

Method Book 1, pg 22, Crossin’ Three, age….closer to 70 than I’d prefer. I’ve played Crossin’ Three nearer 100 times than 50; if a counter indicated more than 200 I wouldn’t argue.

At this point I don’t need to read the score to hit the notes and keep the overall tempo but I’m not terribly satisfied. Dynamically my plucking can vary quite a bit but at least my left hand fingers generally hit the strings where desired. Not always but mostly. My floating thumb or movable anchor, it varies between the two and not by design, differs in effectiveness at moving & muting but is getting better; I still have to think about it. Left hand muting? While I mute via some fingerings, others are not so good but it’ll get there and that maybe due to overload in other areas.

When I’m reading the score + playing, which seems a good exercise from several perspectives, fretting fingers err more, much more for #4 and particular string combinations (C to E on E string being a favorite mashup) and I’m perfectly capable of making a more universal mess of it sometimes...usually on the second pass after a successful first. Of course sometimes it’s a train wrecks due to momentary loss of concentration or not thinking ahead but that’s...whatever. Concentrate and think ahead, better.

I guess this is all to say and hopefully get confirmation that getting to the point that your fretting fingers intrinsically know exactly where to go, you don’t launch into the weeds and just flub the LZ (landing zone) more than you’d like, and your plucking fingers deliver consistent dynamics, can be a very long journey. I mean, like many here I’m sure, I’ve done lotsa mental/physical sporting, thrill seeking, dynamic stuff, much of which can get you killed (or worse) but nothing as small scale, delicate, intricate and demanding as this. So: Am I an outlier or is this just really devilishly hard and slow, particularly when your, well, if not yet on the final approach of a life, definitely in the descent phase and nearing the landing pattern?

Cheers, and thanks for any insights.

Thanks for the honest post. It’s encouraging to know that I’m not alone in the struggle!

 

[LetItGrowTone]

Me too.

 

[bassfiddlesteve]

Method Book 1, pg 22, Crossin’ Three, age….closer to 70 than I’d prefer. I’ve played Crossin’ Three nearer 100 times than 50; if a counter indicated more than 200 I wouldn’t argue.

At this point I don’t need to read the score to hit the notes and keep the overall tempo but I’m not terribly satisfied. Dynamically my plucking can vary quite a bit but at least my left hand fingers generally hit the strings where desired. Not always but mostly. My floating thumb or movable anchor, it varies between the two and not by design, differs in effectiveness at moving & muting but is getting better; I still have to think about it. Left hand muting? While I mute via some fingerings, others are not so good but it’ll get there and that maybe due to overload in other areas.

When I’m reading the score + playing, which seems a good exercise from several perspectives, fretting fingers err more, much more for #4 and particular string combinations (C to E on E string being a favorite mashup) and I’m perfectly capable of making a more universal mess of it sometimes...usually on the second pass after a successful first. Of course sometimes it’s a train wrecks due to momentary loss of concentration or not thinking ahead but that’s...whatever. Concentrate and think ahead, better.

I guess this is all to say and hopefully get confirmation that getting to the point that your fretting fingers intrinsically know exactly where to go, you don’t launch into the weeds and just flub the LZ (landing zone) more than you’d like, and your plucking fingers deliver consistent dynamics, can be a very long journey. I mean, like many here I’m sure, I’ve done lotsa mental/physical sporting, thrill seeking, dynamic stuff, much of which can get you killed (or worse) but nothing as small scale, delicate, intricate and demanding as this. So: Am I an outlier or is this just really devilishly hard and slow, particularly when your, well, if not yet on the final approach of a life, definitely in the descent phase and nearing the landing pattern?

Cheers, and thanks for any insights.

At this stage in your learning process only continued repetition will yield the results you seek. Once muscle memory kicks in, you won't have to concentrate on doing several things at once and your success ratio will improve. You might try isolating certain techniques individually such as left hand muting, string crossings, and alternating your right hand fingers by playing simple, repetitive exercises that focus on these things.

If you are not working with a teacher, I also suggest practicing in front of a mirror and comparing your left and right hand techniques with professional bass players to make sure things are on track from a physical standpoint. Ed Friedland has several bass review videos on his Bass Whisperer YouTube channel and they would be a good example of what proper technique looks like.

Lastly, be patient as leaning to play an instrument as an adult has some unique challenges. As adults, we are used to knowing how to do stuff and it can be frustrating when our progress seems slow. I always told my adult students to "allow yourself to suck" for a while but make sure you practice a little every day as opposed to periods of intense practice that are spaced too far apart. You'll get there if you put in the time!

- Steve

 

[FearNoEvil65]

It's been a while since I worked on anything in the Hal Leonard Bass book, but today I pulled it out and just let the song download play through and I read the songs along in the book as far as I could before I really started to screw up. I blame this thread for getting me into it LOL, you bad influencers all!!
It gets pretty complicated, I'm going to have to go back and practice lots of the stuff.
I made it to about 83, Minor Modulation and 84, Mod Crazy as I can't jump swiftly though key changes like that. Yet, anyways. Over about 3 or 4 sharps or flats really slows me down also.
Lots of good stuff in this Complete Edition, it's nice to play along with the songs like that while reading.
I read through Jeff Berlin and John Patitucci's Etudes regularly also and print out sings ocassionally to learn by reading.
I think reading music is productive and teaches a lot, more Bassists should get into it.
I've improved a lot in the year and a half I've been at it, anyone doing it keep going do a little every day. Take care and wishing everyone the best in their Bass playing endeavors, Peace and good health wishes for all.

 

[FearNoEvil65]

Here's a song I've been working on by reading, Watching the Detectives by Elvis Costello.
Not really my style of music but I love the bass line. If anyone's interested, here's the sheet music, give it a go.
No sharps or flats, but the rhythms are a bit tricky, at least for me.

 

[NotAGardener]

At this stage in your learning process only continued repetition will yield the results you seek. Once muscle memory kicks in, you won't have to concentrate on doing several things at once and your success ratio will improve. You might try isolating certain techniques individually such as left hand muting, string crossings, and alternating your right hand fingers by playing simple, repetitive exercises that focus on these things.

If you are not working with a teacher, I also suggest practicing in front of a mirror and comparing your left and right hand techniques with professional bass players to make sure things are on track from a physical standpoint. Ed Friedland has several bass review videos on his Bass Whisperer YouTube channel and they would be a good example of what proper technique looks like.

Lastly, be patient as leaning to play an instrument as an adult has some unique challenges. As adults, we are used to knowing how to do stuff and it can be frustrating when our progress seems slow. I always told my adult students to "allow yourself to suck" for a while but make sure you practice a little every day as opposed to periods of intense practice that are spaced too far apart. You'll get there if you put in the time!

- Steve

Thank you Steve! That is excellent advice.

I wasn't laughing at the time but during the practice that led to my post I did grok, grudgingly, that I'd be lousy for quite a while, in numerous ways and (clearly) not improve nearly as rapidly as I'd like but it's helpful to get the professional reinforcement wrt that reality! "Embrace the Suck" will have to become my motto.

While I've been picking up muting opportunities here/there I'm not sweating that particular aspect or the floating/moving anchor thumb bit and it's for the reason you articulated; limiting focus. Right now it's plucking well, trying to fret accurately with and without looking at the fretboard constantly and reading the score; sounds and feels like it would be beneficial to break those three out for individual focus as well. While I have an OK success rate at playing it without looking at the score I realized that I need to keep reading it to continue developing that skill and the associated brain/motor connections.

Anyhow, good to know it's going to be slow going and I'll employ your tips. I don't have an instructor so I'll get in front of a mirror and check out the HL resource you mentioned. There is a guy that comes highly recommended by an acquaintance my age who's been playing various guitars & mandolins since his teenage years. I'd made initial contact months ago but as a committed DIY guy, thinking that I needed to get some initial fretting development first, and to avoid the hassle of driving I let it drop; perhaps it's time to rethink that.

And the right thumb: I've not settled on precisely where I prefer it be placed, which step on the PU (G&L Kiloton with a step on the PU edge), PU corner or straight portion, how to bend/shape it when resting against the PU, not pushing it into the PU, how to smoothly ramp it up/over/across the E-string, keeping it planar so as to engage and mute the other strings, where/how to index it when moving to the next string (fingernail v just knowing), how much heel of hand pressure to apply against the slab body, and so on. That's a substantial subject area in itself...how to "drive" that thing well! I'm not sweating it at all now, but I am intellectually amazed at the realization that it's a substantial "thing" with an unclear answer for the time being, and which will evolve over time! Who'da thunk it!

Thanks again,
John

 

[Wannabebass]

Thank you Steve! That is excellent advice.

I wasn't laughing at the time but during the practice that led to my post I did grok, grudgingly, that I'd be lousy for quite a while, in numerous ways and (clearly) not improve nearly as rapidly as I'd like but it's helpful to get the professional reinforcement wrt that reality! "Embrace the Suck" will have to become my motto.

While I've been picking up muting opportunities here/there I'm not sweating that particular aspect or the floating/moving anchor thumb bit and it's for the reason you articulated; limiting focus. Right now it's plucking well, trying to fret accurately with and without looking at the fretboard constantly and reading the score; sounds and feels like it would be beneficial to break those three out for individual focus as well. While I have an OK success rate at playing it without looking at the score I realized that I need to keep reading it to continue developing that skill and the associated brain/motor connections.

Anyhow, good to know it's going to be slow going and I'll employ your tips. I don't have an instructor so I'll get in front of a mirror and check out the HL resource you mentioned. There is a guy that comes highly recommended by an acquaintance my age who's been playing various guitars & mandolins since his teenage years. I'd made initial contact months ago but as a committed DIY guy, thinking that I needed to get some initial fretting development first, and to avoid the hassle of driving I let it drop; perhaps it's time to rethink that.

And the right thumb: I've not settled on precisely where I prefer it be placed, which step on the PU (G&L Kiloton with a step on the PU edge), PU corner or straight portion, how to bend/shape it when resting against the PU, not pushing it into the PU, how to smoothly ramp it up/over/across the E-string, keeping it planar so as to engage and mute the other strings, where/how to index it when moving to the next string (fingernail v just knowing), how much heel of hand pressure to apply against the slab body, and so on. That's a substantial subject area in itself...how to "drive" that thing well! I'm not sweating it at all now, but I am intellectually amazed at the realization that it's a substantial "thing" with an unclear answer for the time being, and which will evolve over time! Who'da thunk it!

Thanks again,
John

Patience is the key (as I have to keep reminding myself) Also feeling ok with walking away from a practice session after not playing well. My understanding is that even while we sleep some stuff we have been practicing gets cemented in and the next day we will provably be incrementally better. Plus NOT carrying on and repeating the same mistake - stopping, slowing down and repeating one single section is a very useful exercise. I believe Janek Gwizdala has video on "what you can do in ten minutes" which focuses on this.
I really wish I had started playing so much younger. Seeing how quickly my 28 year old son picks stuff up is very humbling!
Enjoy the journey

 

[Bass]

...It gets pretty complicated, I'm going to have to go back and practice lots of the stuff...
I made it to about 83, Minor Modulation and 84, Mod Crazy as I can't jump swiftly though key changes like that. Yet, anyways. Over about 3 or 4 sharps or flats really slows me down also...

These two exercises are difficult! For key changes, I think it's helpful to have a good understanding of scales.

The book dedicates 2 or 3 pages to scales just before the modulation exercises. But the small number of page space doesn't reflect the large amount of time necessary to understand the material.

I spend a few minutes each day working on scales.

 

[EddiePlaysBass]

I spend a few minutes each day working on scales.

To this day, I lack the discipline to do "micro practice sessions". I would benefit so much from picking up the bass or uke for 5 to 10 minutes of focused practice on any given aspect. Be it a chord, rhythm, scale, anything.

Instead I tend to go (two) weeks without any practice and then expect to make progress like I did 25 years ago, when I practiced an hour a day, every day.

Some day, some day...

 

[SteC]

To this day, I lack the discipline to do "micro practice sessions". I would benefit so much from picking up the bass or uke for 5 to 10 minutes of focused practice on any given aspect. Be it a chord, rhythm, scale, anything.

Instead I tend to go (two) weeks without any practice and then expect to make progress like I did 25 years ago, when I practiced an hour a day, every day.

Some day, some day...

Yeah I find it so hard to be consistent anymore. If anyone has any ideas haha.

Lately I've been trying to put the phone down and practice reading a little bit while I drink the morning cup of tea, which has been good!

 

[NotAGardener]

I checked out Ed Friedland’s you-tube channel for demonstrations of physical technique and the Know your Neck series jumped out at me. I don’t see pausing my work in Method Book 1 but I wonder if it makes sense to work on note location per the KyN series, too. If so I can’t help but think about how to best approach it from an instructional design perspective. What that KyN series shows, as Ed demos hitting note locations all over the fretboard, is the distilled result of his decades of work and not necessarily how to efficiently go about performing the exercises; so, how to do it? What comes to my mind is using small, colored sticky-back dots for a given note; but, then again, maybe counting the 1 down, 5 up on the fretboard for each exercise movement burns it into memory better, even if it seems slower.

Having just typed this I get the feeling that MB1 may be accomplishing the same thing but in more manageable, bite sized chunks.

Ideas?

Toby Esterhase: "You're an old spy in a hurry; you used to say they were the worst"
George Smiley: "Oh, they are"

 

[Wannabebass]

I checked out Ed Friedland’s you-tube channel for demonstrations of physical technique and the Know your Neck series jumped out at me. I don’t see pausing my work in Method Book 1 but I wonder if it makes sense to work on note location per the KyN series, too. If so I can’t help but think about how to best approach it from an instructional design perspective. What that KyN series shows, as Ed demos hitting note locations all over the fretboard, is the distilled result of his decades of work and not necessarily how to efficiently go about performing the exercises; so, how to do it? What comes to my mind is using small, colored sticky-back dots for a given note; but, then again, maybe counting the 1 down, 5 up on the fretboard for each exercise movement burns it into memory better, even if it seems slower.

Having just typed this I get the feeling that MB1 may be accomplishing the same thing but in more manageable, bite sized chunks.

Ideas?

Toby Esterhase: "You're an old spy in a hurry; you used to say they were the worst"
George Smiley: "Oh, they are"

I've found that while learning a new tune sometimes certain notes just get burned in their locations by default. Maybe because its the start of a new phrase, or just because I've found a new location that works well in the context of what I'm trying to learn. I'd say do the KyN exercises as Ed has prescribed - it's all going to help!

 

[NotAGardener]

A few nights of dog sitting for an old friend has presented me a lot of spare time which I used to noodle around with the crossin 3 exercise. I also spent some time locating notes via the one down, five up method as well as the fretboard chart I have.

One worthwhile supporting skill will be learning to quickly identify a five fret jump just by looking at the dots on the neck and the relative fret offsets. Another one will be learning some relaxed seated positions that will allow practicing while being comfortable for a relatively long period of time while you just monkey around with the instrument.

 

[NotAGardener]

Re^^: Shoulda said "am using to noodle"; last night was the first of a three day/night stay. After yesterdays efforts, the utility of working through it exactly as demo'ed by Ed has become apparent; I have to chuckle at myself, too; the colored dot idea seems like it would have been a kludgy crutch with some downstream disadvantages; just have to work through it the old fashioned way.

This is a very sweet gig actually; quiet solitude in an old, eclectic house on one of Florida's few remaining, relatively unspoiled by development, spring fed rivers. Its rare to not see bald eagles. If you've seen the documentary Muscle Shoals its an analog to the lake place where Jaimoe visited Duane. Now, if some of that magic will cosmically rub off I'll be sittin in hi cotton.

 

[bassfiddlesteve]

Re^^: Shoulda said "am using to noodle"; last night was the first of a three day/night stay. After yesterdays efforts, the utility of working through it exactly as demo'ed by Ed has become apparent; I have to chuckle at myself, too; the colored dot idea seems like it would have been a kludgy crutch with some downstream disadvantages; just have to work through it the old fashioned way.

This is a very sweet gig actually; quiet solitude in an old, eclectic house on one of Florida's few remaining, relatively unspoiled by development, spring fed rivers. Its rare to not see bald eagles. If you've seen the documentary Muscle Shoals its an analog to the lake place where Jaimoe visited Duane. Now, if some of that magic will cosmically rub off I'll be sittin in hi cotton.

I think your best bet is to stick with the Hal Leonard method for now and avoid any visual aids on the neck. I teach upright bass and new students often want to put markers on the neck and I always tell them not to because they are useless in real playing scenarios where you have to be looking at other things (i.e. music, conductor, other musicians, the audience, etc.). Through consistent practice you will eventually memorize the note locations on the neck and develop muscle memory. If you supplement your studies with anything it should be some lessons, either in person or via Zoom/Skype.

Where in Florida is this house?

- Steve