Trace Elliot is stepping up...By going small.....

#341
iamprowla said:
Hmmm, is 500W into an inefficient cab louder than 200W into an efficient one?
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Depends on the actual efficiencies. Due to the logarithmic nature of the decibel scale, doubling the power results in a 3dB increase, which is "detectable". Ten times the power is about 10dB, which is roughly "twice as loud".

Efficiency becomes a factor here, in that a 95dB driver at 500 watts will be roughly as loud as a 98dB driver at 250 watts. (But efficiency ratings are an oversimplification, as they're typically measured at 1kHz, which is likely not the frequency of interest for a bassist.) It's pretty easy to find two drivers whose efficiencies differ by 3dB; and you'll need about twice as much wattage to run the less efficient driver to the same loudness.

Cab design is important here as well. A good cab design will maximize the efficiency of its intended driver, requiring less power. Efficiency is definitely your friend.
 
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#343
Also remember that amplifier wattage should be thought of as a "power reserve". If you're playing through a 800W amplifier, you will rarely if ever play loud enough to actually be putting out all 800W. It's like the gas pedal on your car. You don't use all of the horsepower of a big V-12 when running errands around town, or cruising on the freeway. The power is there if you need it, but you rarely if ever need it.
 
#344
I'm not sure I'd say that 200W is anaemic and only fit for acoustic gigs. Back in 'The day' I had a 130BLX with extension cab, so 130W into 2x10 and it worked for rock gigs in pubs, and on stage monitoring for audiences to 500. Later it was an AH300SM into a Marshall 2x10 (preferred the sound to the TE 2x10s), and that was pretty loud and the normal speakers sounded better than the BLX.
 
#345
ctmullins said:
Also remember that amplifier wattage should be thought of as a "power reserve". If you're playing through a 800W amplifier, you will rarely if ever play loud enough to actually be putting out all 800W. It's like the gas pedal on your car. You don't use all of the horsepower of a big V-12 when running errands around town, or cruising on the freeway. The power is there if you need it, but you rarely if ever need it.
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Power in reserve is definitely good.
 
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#347
ctmullins said:
Also remember that amplifier wattage should be thought of as a "power reserve". If you're playing through a 800W amplifier, you will rarely if ever play loud enough to actually be putting out all 800W. It's like the gas pedal on your car. You don't use all of the horsepower of a big V-12 when running errands around town, or cruising on the freeway. The power is there if you need it, but you rarely if ever need it.
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I've been out in my 1.8 today...

it goes like the clappers

...mind you, it is a Lotus.
 
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#348
Based on my experience, the ELF's 200w pushing two of the 2x8's is enough to keep up in a loudish band practice setting, but I would not gig with that setup. However, with 800w behind them, those two 2x8's were more than adequate for full gig duty. In fact, I probably could have easily gone with a 500w head and still had plenty of headroom. I used the output from the Transit-B into the power amp input on a Quilter BB800, and it was a bona fide Trace Elliot tone, with plenty of power and headroom. Presuming that there is a more powerful Trace Elliot head coming down the road, I feel that Peavey is doing some exciting things with the Trace brand. I stand by my initial conclusion that these 2x8's are an "instant classic." :thumbsup:
 
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#349
tombowlus said:
Based on my experience, the ELF's 200w pushing two of the 2x8's is enough to keep up in a loudish band practice setting, but I would not gig with that setup. However, with 800w behind them, those two 2x8's were more than adequate for full gig duty. In fact, I probably could have easily gone with a 500w head and still had plenty of headroom. I used the output from the Transit-B into the power amp input on a Quilter BB800, and it was a bona fide Trace Elliot tone, with plenty of power and headroom. Presuming that there is a more powerful Trace Elliot head coming down the road, I feel that Peavey is doing some exciting things with the Trace brand. I stand by my initial conclusion that these 2x8's are an "instant classic." :thumbsup:
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I have always wondered about 8's for bass as a good way to get strong mids without the tweety stuff that I always roll off or turn off anyway. Markbass used to make a 4x8 and Audiokinesis offers a 35 lb 4x8 that I have looked upon with lust in my heart. Alas, so much cool gear available, yet so little time and money. The natural question is whether or not you can get a deep enough tone out of an 8 inch driver, but Phil Jones seems to have blown up the whole idea that cones have to be big for bass.
 
#350
Doner Designs said:
I have always wondered about 8's for bass as a good way to get strong mids without the tweety stuff that I always roll off or turn off anyway. Markbass used to make a 4x8 and Audiokinesis offers a 35 lb 4x8 that I have looked upon with lust in my heart. Alas, so much cool gear available, yet so little time and money. The natural question is whether or not you can get a deep enough tone out of an 8 inch driver, but Phil Jones seems to have blown up the whole idea that cones have to be big for bass.
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Well, I still consider the venerated EA VL-208 to be one of the "gold standards" in terms of bass enclosures, so yes, you can get great performance from 8" drivers. Of course, a good cab designer can get great performance from a huge variety of different drivers, so people should not get too hung up on driver size, at any rate.
 
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#351
iamprowla said:
I've been out in my 1.8 today...

it goes like the clappers

...mind you, it is a Lotus.
Click to expand...

Not to over-trod an already well-trod path, but that's a great extension of the analogy. The Lotus is a very lightweight and rigid (efficient) chassis (cabinet), which helps it achieve stellar performance from a lower-powered (low-wattage) engine (amplifier). Thanks for that!
 
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#354
Jazz Ad said:
It has extremely simple controls and shows no sign of digital port.
I don't know where you got the notion that digital preamps are common but it's not what I see.
Multieffects aside, I think we can count digital preamps on our hands.
The most prominent ones are the GK Flex, Markbass EVO, TC Toneprint and Berg B-Amp.
Then you have a few modeling preamps like Line6 or Boss and that's it really.
Are there others you can think of?
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I haven't gotten a "notion" I just haven't been able to find documentation otherwise and it is tiny. I'd just like to find out.
 
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#355
tombowlus said:
Based on my experience, the ELF's 200w pushing two of the 2x8's is enough to keep up in a loudish band practice setting, but I would not gig with that setup. However, with 800w behind them, those two 2x8's were more than adequate for full gig duty. In fact, I probably could have easily gone with a 500w head and still had plenty of headroom. I used the output from the Transit-B into the power amp input on a Quilter BB800, and it was a bona fide Trace Elliot tone, with plenty of power and headroom. Presuming that there is a more powerful Trace Elliot head coming down the road, I feel that Peavey is doing some exciting things with the Trace brand. I stand by my initial conclusion that these 2x8's are an "instant classic." :thumbsup:
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I was going to cancel my pre-order and order the GK Plex instead as I have a gig on the 1st of July and GC says "expected to ship" July 10th. GC however cancelled it for me because I "should have called in to say that I was still interested in the item"! I explained to them that none of the regular emails I had been receiving informing me that the pedal was still on back order but not to worry it would ship as soon as they receive mentioned that I should call! That's GC for yo I guess.

I wanted to wait and thought I could as I rarely gig but it is what it is. Thankfully I do enjoy the GK sound as much as the Trace sound! It came out a few bucks cheaper even with sales tax...with a 15% Memorial Day discount.
 
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#356
fbny71 said:
I was going to cancel my pre-order and order the GK Plex instead as I have a gig on the 1st of July and GC says "expected to ship" July 10th. GC however cancelled it for me because I "should have called in to say that I was still interested in the item"! I explained to them that none of the regular emails I had been receiving informing me that the pedal was still on back order but not to worry it would ship as soon as they receive mentioned that I should call! That's GC for yo I guess.

I wanted to wait and thought I could as I rarely gig but it is what it is. Thankfully I do enjoy the GK sound as much as the Trace sound! It came out a few bucks cheaper even with sales tax...with a 15% Memorial Day discount.
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The Plex is super cool, for sure! :thumbsup:
 
#357
fbny71 said:
I was going to cancel my pre-order and order the GK Plex instead as I have a gig on the 1st of July and GC says "expected to ship" July 10th. GC however cancelled it for me because I "should have called in to say that I was still interested in the item"! I explained to them that none of the regular emails I had been receiving informing me that the pedal was still on back order but not to worry it would ship as soon as they receive mentioned that I should call! That's GC for yo I guess.

I wanted to wait and thought I could as I rarely gig but it is what it is. Thankfully I do enjoy the GK sound as much as the Trace sound! It came out a few bucks cheaper even with sales tax...with a 15% Memorial Day discount.
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Hi there,
I bought a Plex recently and have been very happy with the sounds I'm getting. Robert Gallien posted recently that there will be a new firmware update coming in a few weeks that will include some new add ons including cab sims.
But like you I'm also waiting for the Transit B. ;)
Cheers,
Brent
 
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#358
BrentSimons said:
Hi there,
I bought a Plex recently and have been very happy with the sounds I'm getting. Robert Gallien posted recently that there will be a new firmware update coming in a few weeks that will include some new add ons including cab sims.
But like you I'm also waiting for the Transit B. ;)
Cheers,
Brent
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I do expect to be happy with it. It does mean I may never go to the Trace pre now though!
 
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