Tube watts and under-powered cabs

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#22
Old Garage-Bander said:
and "tube power" also is not a thing.
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Technically you are correct...but...consider the following:
"Tube Watts"= conservatively rated, well under max usable setting ;
"SS Watts"= optimistically rated at some weird transient peak, usually at or above max usable setting.

Realistically, given the choice between an all-tube SVT and a Behringer/GC Acoustic (etc...) head, both rated at 300 watts, which is gonna put more "boom" thru an 810 fridge? Serious question, just asking....
 
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#25
bryan gibson said:
Technically you are correct...but...consider the following:
"Tube Watts"= conservatively rated, well under max usable setting ;
"SS Watts"= optimistically rated at some weird transient peak, usually at or above max usable setting.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I think even though it's not terminologically correct "tube watts vs. ss watts" does describe a pretty real phenomenon that holds true across many, many amp designs.

Doesn't deserve to be dismissed the way "underpowering cabs" does! :thumbsup:
 
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#26
NoiseNinja said:
Yes, they can!

It has something to do with interference and potential sound molecules inherent frequencies.

As we all know everything is made of vibrations, so everything vibrate at it's own frequency already, even without any outside stimuli.

That is why even if you are in a completely sonic isolated room alone and with all the light shut off for about 24 hours or so, you will reach a state where your hearing sense will be sharpened at such a degree that you will begin to hear these vibrations as sounds.

The thing is when you under power a cabinet the vibrations going through the speaker is interfering with the potential sound molecules inherent vibrations (the watts that you don't use, so to speak), this will start a chain reaction enhancing both the wave length of the vibrations and the freqency of both your input and the potential sound molecules.

At the point where they reach equal frequency range the actual interference between your input and the inherent vibrations of the under powered speaker will cause the cone of the speaker to vibrate gradually more and more at a gradually faster and faster rate until the speaker cones simply shatters.

Take a look at this bridge, same that happens here, the inherent vibrations of the bridge has reached same frequency as the air waves, caused by the bridge's over sturdy design compared to the strength of the wind actually hitting it:

giphy.gif






:woot:
:roflmao:

Just pulling your leg....

No such thing as under powering a cab, as has already been stated!
Click to expand...

Interestingly, the bridge is a very large, very scary analogy of a wolf tone. If you recreate it for your science project, you will get an A for sure!
 
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#29
I always appreciate a reference to the Tacoma Narrows bridge (Galloping Gertie). It's something every engineering student should study again and again to remind themselves why theory and practice don't always agree.
 
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#31
bryan gibson said:
Technically you are correct...but...consider the following:
"Tube Watts"= conservatively rated, well under max usable setting ;
"SS Watts"= optimistically rated at some weird transient peak, usually at or above max usable setting.

Realistically, given the choice between an all-tube SVT and a Behringer/GC Acoustic (etc...) head, both rated at 300 watts, which is gonna put more "boom" thru an 810 fridge? Serious question, just asking....
Click to expand...

The problem is how watts are measured before marketing adds their "fudge factor".
But the difference is really between power measured under certain conditions vs what you hear under playing conditions. The two factors essentially live on opposite sides of the galaxie.
I suspect the formula is, a 10% increase added after accounting for the disparity between the company's measured power and the power advertised by the competition.
 
#33
Old Garage-Bander said:
I suspect the formula is, a 10% increase added after accounting for the disparity between the company's measured power and the power advertised by the competition.
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Yeah but then that doesn't explain why there's a consistent and decades-long trend of solid state builders over-stating their wattages (or tube builders under-stating theirs). Like if it's all just hooey, why aren't the new all-tube SVTs claiming to be 800 watts like every other class D head?
 
#34
morgan138 said:
Yeah but then that doesn't explain why there's a consistent and decades-long trend of solid state builders over-stating their wattages (or tube builders under-stating theirs). Like if it's all just hooey, why aren't the new all-tube SVTs claiming to be 800 watts like every other class D head?
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I don't think this is universally true at all.

Manufacturers who grossly overstate their power rating do so not because of the technology but because of either intentional or marketing reasons. This is not a consistent, nor decades long situation for all manufacturers.
 
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#37
The 5e3 clone I built has all tube (rectifier, preamp, power tubes) Low watts, and alnico speaker with low watts. Thus the overdrive at low to moderate volumes. If I need a fatter overdrive tone, I change up the rectifier tube to the 5y3 for more sag. For a tighter OD and more headroom, the GZ34 or solidstate rectifier works great. With a VariAC at 112 to 115, this amp runs hot. Literally, hot in heat and tone.
 
#38
agedhorse said:
This is not a consistent, nor decades long situation for all manufacturers.
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Yeah, that was my point...I was responding to someone saying "watts are watts, builders overstate their wattages"! I don't think the tube vs. ss watts thing can be chalked up to just marketing, because if that's all it was it wouldn't have been such a consistent thing for so long.
 
#39
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