Two bass “holy grails” that no longer matter to me

[LadyLoveStingRay5]

I feel this way about owning a vintage bass, a Fender Bass, or a high end boutique bass.

Nothing personal , I’m just over it.
I’ve found my home in EBMM Specials and Sandberg.

 

[Wasnex]

I don't perceive the qualities you describe as grails. I see them more through the concept of the double edged sword. In some instances they are useful and in other instances they are not.

Beyond that, a good fretless player can produce mwah on demand. They can also control it and play in tune. So you wouldn't necessarily even notice they are playing fretless unless they want you to.

Ric 4001 was my first bass. At the time I was anti-PV and anti-P. I still own the 4001 but over the years it has been modded and no longer sounds like a Ric. One could argue that it sounds better. But if I could go back in time I would tell myself to leave it stock. I do agree that it seems to be a challenge to find Rics that sound and play really well. Mine was good but not great (hence the mods). I don't agree that they are one trick ponies. I played a wide range of musical styles on mine...including slap and jazz. I am mildly tempted to get an unmolested Ric, but I doubt I ever will.

 

[Gilmourisgod]

I'll never understand the "One Trick Pony" thing applied to Rics. Have these people not heard Maca and Squire/Geddy Lee? Hard to imagine three more different tones coming out of one bass, it has TWO pickups, afterall, and they sound very different. It IS true that the output between neck and bridge can be noticeably different on Rics, in which case there are some very fine options for pickup upgrades, notably the Classic Amplification ones. And no, you shouldn't have to upgrade the pups on a $2k bass, but people do it all the time on $2k Fenders, and nobody bats an eyelash. Or just adjust the pickups and pole pieces to get a more even balanced output with the stock ones. I must have lucked out, I bought THREE stock Ric hi-gains for this clone build, and the output is virtually identical for all three. Go figure. it's perfectly balanced, sounds great like a Ric should, and I shaved the neck to a 70's skinny profile. They will have to pry this out of my COLD DEAD HANDS! I have found my Holy Grail.

 

[funkymonk13]

But have you ever tried a fretless Ric?

 

[Pyrrho Epoche]

I think it's the "holy trinity":
P bass, jazz bass and Stingray.

 

[_One//Man//Mutiny_]

I’m with you on the fretless, I’m sure after enough time has passed I’ll try another one and go through the lust, acquisition, the honeymoon period, the storage period and then sell another one.
I got lucky with Rickenbackers, it was my Holy Grail and I ended up getting a super, super good one! Then bought a new last year and it’s equally great. Rickenbackers are weird, some of them have “it” and some of them don’t. But when they do, they’re some of the best basses in the world. I’ve had a chance to play some that were horrible though. A good Rick is like striking a tuning fork and a bad one is like striking that same fork with a piece of tape around it.

 

[Low Main]

I have a deep appreciation for the world of non-mwah fretless players.

Funkymonk said: "But have you ever tried a fretless Ric?"

Right on the money. Check out Chris Brubeck on fretless Ric. That's about as close as I've heard an EB with mag pickups get to an upright.

 

[Stewie]

Been playing fretless since 1976. Have tried many times to play with frets. This time I'm sticking to it. The hard part is not looking at the neck and not jumping the guard rail and hitting a half step wrong. I've never wanted "mwah" but, to my annoyance, sometimes the G string will do it on it's own. I guess my grail is my upright, my fretless P and my fretted Squier CV50s Precision ( the one that still has a fretted neck)

 

[Gilmourisgod]

But have you ever tried a fretless Ric?

I'd love to, but I've never seen one, ever, anywhere, in a store for sale, or being played live. So they are either rare as hen's teeth.... or I need to get out more. These days getting one involves satchels of cash, or yanking the frets out a standard Ric.

 

[_Obra_]

I used to have ''Holy Grail'' basses, but not anymore. That probably comes with my age, or the fact that I've played them all at some time, and realized that they are in facts only bass guitars.

 

[funkymonk13]

I'd love to, but I've never seen one, ever, anywhere, in a store for sale, or being played live. So they are either rare as hen's teeth.... or I need to get out more. These days getting one involves satchels of cash, or yanking the frets out a standard Ric.

I actually was just kidding lol. They’re fairly rare but you can find them. Though Can’t imagine you’d like it if you don’t like fret less basses or rics

To each their own. I agree with a lot of your points. For most a fretless is either something you keep around as a novelty or go hardcore into learning to play it with good intonation.

As far as Rics I’ve tried to like them but it’s rough. The guitars especially, I’ve played a few and they all felt awful.
As for the basses, they’re pretty cool. Not a huge fan of the hard edge on 4003 but the “S” model solves that. My biggest gripe with them is most of them have that two truss rod system; apparently the neck can come apart if you adjust them wrong. I just can’t own a bass that I can’t set up

 

[Gilmourisgod]

FYI, Ric has finally dropped the crappy old bridge in favor of one with full string height, intonation, and string spacing adjustment, and changed to a single modern double-action trussrod, so setup is similar to any other bass, though you can usually get Ric actions lower than most, they like a flat neck. Another set of gripes elimianted, but most people don't know it, because Ric marketing sucks. They don't bother because they don't have to, they sell every bass they make, which should tell you something.

 

[coyote1]

FYI, Ric has finally dropped the crappy old bridge in favor of one with full string height, intonation, and string spacing adjustment, and changed to a single modern double-action trussrod, so setup is similar to any other bass, though you can usually get Ric actions lower than most, they like a flat neck. Another set of gripes elimianted, but most people don't know it, because Ric marketing sucks. They don't bother because they don't have to, they sell every bass they make, which should tell you something.

Tells me there are lots of Chris Squire and Geddy Lee wannabes

 

[alembicbones]

While not Holy Grail basses, after many years of searching, I've found both the fretless bass and RIC that work for me.

On the fretless front, I've owned a few over the years, both lined and unlined. There is no doubt that unlined is just impractical for my playing. I get close on intonation but really not good enough. Years ago I had a lined EBMM Stingray 5 fretless. It was a great bass but I sold it to feed some random bout with GAS. I probably went some ten years without a fretless but last year at this time, I picked up a Sadowsky MetroExpress JJ 5 string lined fretless. It wasn't overly pricey so I thought, why not give the fretless thing a try again. No doubt this was the right fretless for me. After I picked it up, I decided that my next gig would be to play the fretless for the entire set. It worked out great. It was very easy to play and super fun. Fast forward to this weekend and I played the fretless at my new jam band's rehearsal. Again, it just worked. This bass is a keeper.

I've owned a few RIC's over the years. The first was a killer looking white 4001 that I bought in high school. As it turned out, I just never bonded with it. I don't think it was the bass, I was just young and stupid. Some 15 years ago I bought a Midnight Blue 4003. Serious looker and played well, but I ran into pickup issues with it. In addition, I was really only playing 5 string basses at the time. Ended up selling it. Then, pre-pandemic, RIC came out with the 4003s/5. After a bit of searching, I found one in Midnight Blue. It took a bit of work to quiet the electronics down but once this was achieved, I finally had the RIC that worked for me. It is one awesome rock 'n roll bass that is super versatile. I feel I'm set.

Bones

 

[logdrum]

Fretless 6 is tough. I personally think that the 20 -21fret 4 string covers most of what a fretless sounds best. Add a detuner for extended low range

 

[lowendrachel]

I still want an unlined fretless 6. I have two Stingrays which has always been my dream basses. However, I'd let the Rays go for a nice hifi 6 string bass.

 

[fdeck]

Not to diminish Jaco's greatness, but anything on fretless was innovative in his time, as was his overall approach to electric bass. But so much has happened since then, that the electric bass is practically a different instrument. If there's one thing I regret about my bass playing (aside from not practicing enough), it's that I didn't make the effort to master the fretted bass when I was younger. Today, it doesn't matter for the work that I do. Since I started on cello, and have been playing upright for decades, fretless has always been the easy way out.

As for Rick, I a chance to buy a 4001 fretless in high school, but the dealer seemed sleazy, and I ended up getting a Kramer DMZ5000 fretless instead. Can't say either one was the best choice, but I was just a kid.

 

[coyote1]

Fretless 6 is tough. I personally think that the 20 -21fret 4 string covers most of what a fretless sounds best. Add a detuner for extended low range

IMO it’s the opposite of that. I rarely use the “extended range” on that instrument. But imagine an endless cascade of ii > V7s through all 12 keys without changing position at all… that’s what the 6 string (if you are using four finger technique instead of the 1 2 4 commonly used on upright) makes easy. 2+ octaves without moving your hand up/down the neck.

 

[LiptonJigglers]

Sold my Maton JB4 fretless bass a year ago. Played it half a dozen times over 20 years and had no real need for it as the situation never arrived.
As much as they sound nice, I could live without one..
Never had a Ric bass so I have nothing to say except that the bassist from Serious Young Insects used one and it sounded awesome on their album Housebreaking.
If I was to GAS for something now, it's an 80s Kramer any model will do thanks.... but they're rare as rocking horse dung around here but, having said that, I'll stick with my MIM Fender P, Yamaha bb435 and Maton JB4 (Fretted) reissue and NXT EUB 5string.

 

[Bob_Ross]

Rickenbacker. The bass that was a huge component of a number of my fave bands (Yes, Deep Purple, Rush, others), the bass that had the distinctive look and sound. Problem is that in looking for one for two decades, I only ever found three that both sounded great and played great.

I'm certain I've told this story on TB before, but fwiw: As a wee teen in the 1970s I thought a Ric 4001 was the shiznit (except in 1975 "shiznit" wasn't yet a word) because I was a huge fan of Chris Squire and Jon Camp. So for the next...oh, at least 10 years if not longer I searched high and low for a Ric 4001 that would achieve that sound. I must have played ~20 different basses.

None of them even came close to the sound that I associated with a Ric 4001.

No, sorry, that's not true: One of them did. (And I wish to hell I could have coaxed it from the hands of its owner, but he wasn't selling.) But even that one, the one that sounded awesome, felt like poo. Weird bass, those Rics.

Yeah, there aren't really any more "holy grail" basses for me these days...unless someone happens upon an Alembic Series I small body 32" scale length that weighs less than 10lbs.