I think his point is that in his area the gigs don't pay well but on the plus side the price of housing is quite affordable.
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What's wrong with 2023 audiences?
- Thread starter Lance Bunyon
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Contacts are only as good as the people signing them. Years ago I had a friend who had a contract and got stiffed so he went to small claims court. They guy showed up, the judge found in my friends favor. On the way out the guy said, "*&$% you, I'm still not paying." I've been playing for over 50 years, mostly without contracts and I can count on one hand how many times I've been cheated. I've never had someone not pay me at all, I've just gotten less than agreed to a couple of times.
Maybe for a couple thousand dollar gig, but for most bar bands, they'll lose more money trying to get the money than they'll get.
Club owners know each other, if you're known for being litigious, it is not a plus!
Exactly. Can't make squat playing bars here, but if one could airlift this house to say... Georgetown, Ma on this same .30 acre it would probably go for $1,200,000.00 to $1,300,000.00.
I consider myself extremely lucky to be living "on" Lake Wylie (not waterfront but 3 blocks to private lake access within the HOA).
We left Massachusetts 10 years ago and build a house in a troubled inner city neighborhood. We had our house fill with bullets one morning during the riots in 2020 (no one got hit by the flying bullets).
Due to the shortage of 4 bedroom houses at the time we made a decent profit on the bullet house and built this one in the burbs.
Sometimes bad things happen to good people, but then work out for the best
$560,000 (converted to Canadian $$) for a 3,000 square foot house would be a bargain here in Ottawa!Exactly. Can't make squat playing bars here, but if one could airlift this house to say... Georgetown, Ma on this same .30 acre it would probably go for $1,200,000.00 to $1,300,000.00.
I consider myself extremely lucky to be living "on" Lake Wylie (not waterfront but 3 blocks to private lake access within the HOA).
We left Massachusetts 10 years ago and build a house in a troubled inner city neighborhood. We had our house fill with bullets one morning during the riots in 2020 (no one got hit by the flying bullets).
Due to the shortage of 4 bedroom houses at the time we made a decent profit on the bullet house and built this one in the burbs.
Sometimes bad things happen to good people, but then work out for the best
We paid $369,000.00 based on 2020 contract...Almost $200,000.00 increase in "value". Either inflation is good for equity, or the world economy is FUBAR!
I will say that the 2024 audiences > 2023 audiences. Part of that could be us settling on a consistent line up and not playing as many gigs, and not taking any old gig that comes along. We quit playing a couple of spots and I think that helped.
Who knows, but for the most part, people are having fun at the gigs. I would like to be playing a bit more though. Having a lot more fun this year than last.
Who knows, but for the most part, people are having fun at the gigs. I would like to be playing a bit more though. Having a lot more fun this year than last.
My observation:
Loads of new gigs on the scene.
Loads of new 'bands' on the scene.
You would think this is good, but nope, not necessarily.
Everytime, a gig goes out even on local SM... I can bet within 12 hrs, they will have 30 responses easily. 80% of the time I've never even heard of most of those putting their names forward....
Would I take a chance on them... 90% No...they'd need very good follow up.
But...I'm not the booker.
And that is without factoring in the fact that new bookers taking over a new venue will think they can buck the going rate.
The best bands are sticking to..and justifying their rate. Everything else can be a cr@p shoot.
Loads of new gigs on the scene.
Loads of new 'bands' on the scene.
You would think this is good, but nope, not necessarily.
Everytime, a gig goes out even on local SM... I can bet within 12 hrs, they will have 30 responses easily. 80% of the time I've never even heard of most of those putting their names forward....
Would I take a chance on them... 90% No...they'd need very good follow up.
But...I'm not the booker.
And that is without factoring in the fact that new bookers taking over a new venue will think they can buck the going rate.
The best bands are sticking to..and justifying their rate. Everything else can be a cr@p shoot.
2 hour round trip drive, outdoors in 95 degree heat, 3 hours of standing/playing/singing in the parking lot? I wouldn't take that gig for the entire $300.
I've had more than 50 years of fun. Given the thousands of gigs I've played over the years and the infinitesimal amount of times I've been cheated, it's just possible that I know what I'm talking about. But who knows, maybe actual experience doesn't count for anything anymore.
Your experience counts with me. I feel you bro.
We have a new venue up on Lake Norman on the 26th. Slightly better pay, slightly upscale "yacht crowd".
I know how to play to the yacht crowd. If they're not digging what we throw down we chill and play Margaritaville for 3 hours (slight exaggeration).
Yep.
I've been playing gigs sine the late 1960's and, other than when the band was actually "on the road", and one other house gig, 90+% of the gigs I've played with without a contract. I can't remember that we ever got stiffed.Yeah, its just possible. Anything is possible.
After 50 (!! )years of playing gigs and never having worked an engagement that required or benefited by a Contract, I can only imagine the HEIGHTS of your esteemed career, and the MAGNITUDE of the venues you have worked at!
C'mon buddy, I'm certainly no major rawk star, but working in ANY professional capacity in a professional environment generally does require a Contractual Agreement between the Venue and the Entertainer(s).
"Having fun" with your "thousands of gigs" of "actual experience" only means that those actual experiences are probably quite local, low-profile, and mostly amateur in nature.
Nothing wrong with that. Most Musicians are non-full time amateurs.
At a certain level of Professionalism in Bookings, a CONTRACT is REQUIRED, even if you yourself are good with a handshake. It doesn't work that way once you step outside the "Joe's Bar" gig world. Really. It doesn't.
Take that to the Bank, "Mr. 50 Years"
Or don't!
From what little I get out and see (after 25 years, it's hard for me to walk into a bar), the problem with 2023/24 audiences is 2023/24 bands. Often totally clueless as how move a house full of people, how to stack and build a set list to fan the flames, everybody on stage has music stands, and as usual, a lot of them can play what they play, but no grasp of doing anything else, they've never had to step out of their little box. and have no vocabulary when it comes to handling more than a few styles. Or sobriety.
True. A contract is only as good as the party who signs it. And winning in small claims court is not a guarantee you'll get paid. My father owned a business and he took many people to small claims court over the years. He won most of the cases too. He finally stopped because in the end he never received the money. The time and aggravation of trying to actually collect the money was more than it was worth. Winning judgement is only the first step.
You know, I tried to care less what you think, but I find that I can't. People like you make this a forum a little worse for everyone else with your snide, snotty comments. I'll leave the blow-hard braggadocio to you, I'm just relaying my experience. Welcome to my ignore list.Yeah, its just possible. Anything is possible.
After 50 (!! )years of playing gigs and never having worked an engagement that required or benefited by a Contract, I can only imagine the HEIGHTS of your esteemed career, and the MAGNITUDE of the venues you have worked at!
C'mon buddy, I'm certainly no major rawk star, but working in ANY professional capacity in a professional environment generally does require a Contractual Agreement between the Venue and the Entertainer(s).
"Having fun" with your "thousands of gigs" of "actual experience" only means that those actual experiences are probably quite local, low-profile, and mostly amateur in nature.
Nothing wrong with that. Most Musicians are non-full time amateurs.
At a certain level of Professionalism in Bookings, a CONTRACT is REQUIRED, even if you yourself are good with a handshake. It doesn't work that way once you step outside the "Joe's Bar" gig world. Really. It doesn't.
Take that to the Bank, "Mr. 50 Years"
Or don't!
This! The behaviour you describe is an extension of the entitled attitude streaming services have created and promote. Music is free and laid on for no effort or cost to the listener. We are wallpaper now. The end user doesn't care.It is simple - nobody needs us anymore
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