An auction of "James Jamerson Owned and Played 1961 Fender Precision Bass..."

#101
Double E said:
I smell a hoax... I wouldn't be surprised to find out that this is simply a carefully doctored replica or re-issue. The pictures are useless for any confirmation. A few of the pictures of Mr. Hayes holding a bass are clearly not the same bass at all and none of them even put the bass and James Jamerson in the same frame.

Then there is the lack of any detailed photos you'd expect to have available to review...neck heel, pot and pickup details...etc...

It's just a pathetic attempt of a money grab as far as I am concerned and I feel sorry for anyone who falls for it.

Call me a "Buzz Killington" if you want and I am no expert but this is my gut instinct.
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Hello. Though I am inclined to agree with you, also I acknowledge that there is a third way. Since presence does not denote cause, we can allow the possibility that the seller's bumbling attempts to show provenance (historical photos of him playing any Precision Bass, an affidavit from the present day, etc.) are not necessarily proof that this instrument is not the one he claims it is.

In other words, this bass could be Jamerson's former property, even the very one claimed, even if it were modified other than claimed and/or is being otherwise poorly represented now.

That said, a serious bidder will require real proofs; and so far, yes, those seem not to be available.
 
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#102
I bought this from a guy named James.....does it count.
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#107
I am pretty confident that bass could be a perfectly decent player.

But, this auction is alleging celebrity collectibility status. Yet, the provenance clearly shows the bass not to be the instrument claimed. That's a pretty major problem for the auction.

Further, the lack of certain typical pre-CBS features raises questions about the authenticity of the bass, irrespective of the celebrity status. For that reason alone, I wouldn't touch the instrument with a ten foot pole. Woe unto uninformed buyers.
 
#110
This is one of the pics that has some distinct similarities on the pickguard with some markings that are very similar to the auction bass.

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However, you can make out the location of the string tree and Fender logo just enough to verify that the neck is perhaps not the same. On the auction bass the string tree is closer to the A tuner and the Fender logo is not in the same location. So, probably not the original neck which explains the missing hootenanny button.

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#111
2 tone sunburst + rosewood + tort - hootenanny = late '59.

Could be a neck swap, but I highly doubt that. Neck swaps usually have newer necks than the rest of the bass, not older. Everything says late '59 except the plate and we know how reliable the plates are... not very.

Also, dude can probably expect a call from JJ's estate.
 
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#113
Absolutely a 2 tone.
So are these, both late '59:

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The black/brown overspray into the amber is what you are seeing as faded red. Some 2tsb have a very sharp black line, some have overspray making it look 3 tone. The bass in the auction is 2 tone.
 
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#115
FWIW - I'm certainly not qualified to speak on the authenticity of this bass, and normally I'd lean to about 99% for it being a fake, but one point should be considered here.

I have done lots of business with and participated in more than a few auctions over the past 20+ years with Heritage, and I can say for a fact that their reputation is quite solid. They do have different people handling specific categories - and I can only speak on the Comic Book and Comic Art field of their operations - in which I do know they're a major player and well-respected throughout the community.

And don't believe there isn't big jack thrown down in the Comic category - I've seen auctions for cover art and/or a single book exceed $200K over the years. A company like that doesn't usually bring an item to auction without some due-dilligence. Just a little food for thought...


~R7~
 
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#116
Richie Seven and Primo said:
FWIW - I'm certainly not qualified to speak on the authenticity of this bass, and normally I'd lean to about 99% for it being a fake, but one point should be considered here.

I have done lots of business with and participated in more than a few auctions over the past 20+ years with Heritage, and I can say for a fact that their reputation is quite solid. They do have different people handling specific categories - and I can only speak on the Comic Book and Comic Art field of their operations - in which I do know they're a major player and well-respected throughout the community.

And don't believe there isn't big jack thrown down in the Comic category - I've seen auctions for cover art and/or a single book exceed $200K over the years. A company like that doesn't usually bring an item to auction without some due-dilligence. Just a little food for thought...


~R7~
Click to expand...
Apparently, whoever is in charge of vintage musical instruments is not 100% on the ball or they'd have some more specific detail on the origin of manufacture and perhaps an appraisal or at least an evaluation by a qualified third party. All they did to set up this sale is a little research on James Jamerson to create a fluff piece on how beloved he is to the music community and post some pretty pics of the assembled bass along with some scans of a few photos, some of which may or may not depict the actual bass in the auction or support the current owner's claims.

A truly credible auction house should do much more than they apparently have to establish provenance and validate the back-story.
 
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#117
Matt O said:
Absolutely a 2 tone.
So are these, both late '59:

View attachment 1135493 View attachment 1135498

The black/brown overspray into the amber is what you are seeing as faded red. Some 2tsb have a very sharp black line, some have overspray making it look 3 tone. The bass in the auction is 2 tone.
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I disagree, both of those basses are 3-tone sunbursts (with the red a little more faded out in one than the other). That thick black perimiter on the one bass is a tell tale sign of a late '59-61 era 3-tone sunburst. The reason I say these are both 3-tones is because Fender had already replaced the 2-tone with 3-tone in 1958, well before they started even offering rosewood boards and tort pickguards. The red often just fades... even my 1969 jazz has almost no red in it anymore (except you can see under the bridge cover that it's a 3-tone).

Here are some examples of some true (1958 andf earlier) 2-tone bursts...
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Here's a shot of my '69 Jazz to show how much the red can fade, even on a poly CBS era bass...
IMG_2610.JPG
 
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#119
Double E said:
Apparently, whoever is in charge of vintage musical instruments is not 100% on the ball or they'd have some more specific detail on the origin of manufacture and perhaps an appraisal or at least an evaluation by a qualified third party. All they did to set up this sale is a little research on James Jamerson to create a fluff piece on how beloved he is to the music community and post some pretty pics of the assembled bass along with some scans of a few photos, some of which may or may not depict the actual bass in the auction or support the current owner's claims.

A truly credible auction house should do much more than they apparently have to establish provenance and validate the back-story.
Click to expand...
For some people, the belief in what something is, is more important than what it actually is. Also, there's a sucker born every minute.
 
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