Double Bass Do you emphasize 2 & 4 while walking in 4?

Tom Lane

Tom Lane

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Apr 28, 2011
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#1
Today, a teacher, a drummer, told me to emphasize 2 and 4 more while we're playing Autumn Leaves. We're copping the Miles recording with the riff intro. It's slowish at about 105 bpm. My regular teacher made a similar comment a few months ago and suggested that I set the metronome on 2 & 4 and play a melody against it. I did that and I agree, it does swing better. I also started encorporating a lot more hammer-ons, and pull-offs emphasizing 2 & 4 and I also agree that it seems to swing better. But, emphasizing 2 and 4 while walking in 4 seems a bit difficult when I tried it today. Do you agree with the teacher? Are there times when it isn't appropriate?
 
#3
I don't agree with the teacher at all. All four quarter notes in each bar of walking bass should be evenly played, evenly accented. The goal is to provide a foundation and move the music forward. To my ear and sensibility, 2 and 4 accents introduce an unnatural hump that just isn't right.

Listen to other examples of that tune (besides Miles / Cannonball), as well as tracks by other bands / recordings of that era. (remember jazz is an aural tradition, not an academic one.) Do you hear bass lines with emphasis on 2 & 4?

It's actually good that you are taking lessons with a drummer. Hopefully you are talking about lock-up between the two instruments. Walking bass lines line up more with the ride cymbal than any other part of the drum kit. Is you teacher accenting 2 and 4 when they play the ride?

I recall there are other threads on this very topic. Curious to hear what others have to say.
 
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#4
Perhaps I've misunderstood. Sounds like you are trying to accent 2 and 4 in your playing while playing with the metronome?

I agree that feeling the metronome on 2 and 4 is a good way to practice walking lines, melody, etc

Are you having difficulty feeling the metronome as 2 and 4? It takes practice and a shift in perception.
 
#5
Two different pieces of advice from two completely different teachers, but the advice is similar and focused on beats 2 & 4. Both teachers are drummers, coincidentally. Teacher 1 said, play a melody to a metronome set on 2 & 4. I got it pretty quickly. Teacher 2 said, while walking in 4, emphasize beats 2 & 4. Listening to a drummer's ride cymbal, each beat sounds identical to me. Listening to bassists, I certainly don't hear an emphasize on beat 1 and 3 and maybe that's what he was really trying to say, don't emphasize beats 1 & 3, which I might be doing. I'll have to listen to a recording of myself to see.

Update, yes, I see that I'm putting a slight emphasis on beat 1. I think that's the problem. The other three beats are mostly the same.
 
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#8
I've played walking-four lines for years and the thought never crossed my mind: That guy sitting next to me behind all that shiny metal is supposed to whack that little drum in front of him next to the hi-hat harder on 2 and 4, not me. I can even think of old country records when they didn't use drums that was recorded with slap upright and no drums, and they didn't hit 2 and 4 either.

I s'pose there's a place for it, I just can't think of anything. To create a syncopated back beat, you have to have something on the off or back beat on top against a steady rolling bottom, otherwise you'd just get this unison TWO and FOUR vertically, and it's just hard for me to envision that working, but having said that, I'm very sure it could have been done and it's outside my experience.
 
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#10
Granted I'm novice compared to the TBers above, but what I understand from my teacher and paying attention is that okay 4 on the floor even and straight is rhe foundation, with rhythmic accents preferably in relationship to the rhythm of the melody and what everyone is doing at the time, rather than a prescriptive formula like pulse on 2 and 4. It does sound cool in spots though.
 
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#17
Here’s a link to an older thread about this: https://www.talkbass.com/threads/walking-bass-accents.1142263/post-17119215

I believe that accents in a walking line should be variable, since accents are part of what makes the line dance and should be determined by musical intent, the melodic shape of the line, and what’s going on around the bass line. But many of my students have gone through phases where they accent 2&4 because somebody told them to do this, or because it became a habit from playing with a click on 2&4, or from locking in with the hi hat instead of the ride. When a student finds themselves in that place, we approach it not as a bad thing, but rather as something to transcend.

Eventually, I do an exercise with most students where we work on accents specifically. It involves the following:
- Play a line with no accents
- Accent 1 every time
- Accent 2 every time
- Same for 3&4
- Eventually, accent in the way the line you are playing calls for in order to make it dance rather than plodding along predictably.

But whatever happens, everything we do is a learning opportunity, and we are always learning. I think right now, your teachers are probably trying to get you to play more consistently and predictably to help hold the group together.
 
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#19
Do not play 2 and 4 louder than 1 and 3. I think I do sometimes emphasize 2 or 4 in the sense of thinking of them as "action" notes that lead to the "home" notes on 1 or 3. In the great tension-release scheme that drives music forward, dissonance is a type of "accent" and might be what your teachers are hearing. I assume they are good drummers and hear something in Sam Jones's playing on that track that they are trying to articulate. One of the things that always strikes me about that track is that it demonstrates why Miles Davis is such a revered genius. Listen what happens when he starts his solo. The already great music just elevates to a new level. The rhythm section galvanizes and it's thrilling. His genius was band deep, not just playing solos. He's like Duke or Jamal in that regard.
 
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#20
My first instrument is drums. I can see where drummers might advise you to emphasize the two and four; that is where the hihat is played, and it is that hihat that everyone else keys on when they are playing. And when I’m playing brushes, I use patterns that also emphasize two and four.

But on bass? Nope. If any beat should be accented on bass, it is the downbeat (one).

All that aside though, your objective with accented notes is to be able to accent ANY note you play at will. There are many instruction books, often written for drummers but applicable across all instruments, that contain exercises focusing on this aspect of musicianship.
 
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