Groove Isn't The First Element of Bass Playing. It is Last!

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JeffBerlin

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Jan 10, 2009
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I thought to share this thought as groove seems to be THE main focus among bass teachers and bass players in general. Bass education seems focused on the belief that groove is paramount even in how one learns. It is such a strong belief that I submit that it is hard to find any school or bass teacher who hasn't focused on the learning or playing of groove even to the degree where no mention of the very thing that gives groove a reason to exist which are the notes, is mentioned as equally important.

Ultimately, no part of a musical principle is more or less important than any other part. A bass line consists of notes, rhythm, groove, bass tone, emotion and all the little flecks of music and humanity that makes for a fine bass performance. But because bass teachers have (in my opinion) swayed bass players in a bad direction by suggesting or stating that groove is the most important aspect of playing, I wanted to put the record straight.

In either playing or learning, groove isn't first in the steps of importance. Groove is last! Here is why!

Artistic exceptions aside, the first requirement of playing a bass part is to know what the notes are.

Following this, you have to figure out where those notes fall on the fretboard. And then you need to play them.

Once a bass line is learned well to where you can play it with little or no thought (people sometimes refer to this as muscle memory) then the remaining requirement is to play the line with feeling or artistic intention. It is here where groove can show up in its full capacity. But not before!

Again, ultimately, groove is no more or less important than any other aspect of musical performance. But because bass players and teachers think otherwise, I wanted to lay out the step that we all take to learn and then play a bass part.

Please share your thoughts. Cheers from Jeff
 
I have no real disagreement with that idea.

some seem to view "groove" in rather magical terms, like some undefinable sublime inner musical truth.
And it's the unwillingness to define it that leads people to say things like "You can't teach groove" or "either you have it or you don't"

I think of "groove" similarly to how its laid out in Victor Wooten's Groove Workshop.
It's not single thing
It's a compound phenomenon , made up of fundamental elements
a weakness in one's "groove" is best understood a weakness in one or more of the elements
an improvement in one's "groove" is best achieved via improvement in one or more of the elements

breaking "groove" down like this makes is available for productive practical discussion - and teaching
 
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Finally something I might Be quiet ble to disagree with Jeff Berlin on.
When I was at Bass "school", a fellow student from a foreign land (one of the ones with "fjords")
Arrived with reading skills and theory knowledge far exceeding many of his peers attendance. Dare I say Advanced.
When he performed with an ensemble however, he was stiff as a board. His groove was for poopiee.

He eventually graduated with high academic honors and went on to a successful career as a bassist/composer sideman with respected artists and accepted a teaching position at the same "bass school".
His academic background had no small part in this I'm sure.
But it still took him a few years to get his groove together. He certainly did, but without the ability to "groove". I believe he would have been much less successful in the gigging and studio world.

Maybe I actually am making your point, Jeff, but I think all this semantic talk has become circular
 
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My take on this starts with most new students having a problem hearing the bass drum beat, which IMO must happen for a groove to develop. Groove is a learned skill that develops after a lot of playing time.

In order to keep their interest I agree finding and listening to the notes gives them the ability to feel like they are making progress. It is from the progress they finally get to groove.
 
I think of "groove" similarly to how its laid out in Victor Wooten's Groove Workshop.
It's not single thing
It's a compound phenomenon , made up of fundamental elements
a weakness in one's "groove" is best understood a weakness in one or more of the elements
an improvement in one's "groove" is best achieved via improvement in one or more of the elements

breaking "groove" down like this makes is available for productive practical discussion - and teaching
When bass teachers started offering lessons and discussions about groove, in essence, they were focusing on a subject that wasn't that important to focus on. In the past, barely anyone in education mentioned it. In live playing or recording, it was too obvious a thing to bring up, sort of like telling a driver to focus on stepping on the brakes when they wanted to slow down a car.
 
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My take on this starts with most new students having a problem hearing the bass drum beat, which IMO must happen for a groove to develop. Groove is a learned skill that develops after a lot of playing time.

In order to keep their interest I agree finding and listening to the notes gives them the ability to feel like they are making progress. It is from the progress they finally get to groove.
Having a sense of groove is not tied to playing bass. I've had beginner students whose ability to groove has been immediately evident. It didn't come after learning the notes on the fingerboard - it was already there.
 
Groove, used in this context, is likely shorthand for something the teacher either can't put their finger on or can't articulate. That may be an indicator they lack enough expertise with the instrument. For example, a high school band teacher has to be able to teach many instruments without really being an expert in most of them.

Having said that, I suspect it's usually a question of inadequate teaching skills. I know that sounds harsh, and perhaps it is, but as someone who has done some (non-music) teaching, I find that many, perhaps even most, teachers are much better at knowing things than explaining them.

There's an old adage which says those who can do, and those who can't teach. The problem with that reasoning is it implies that teaching is not a skill unto itself. To be a good teacher you have to be able to answer questions you never had to ask because you just intuitively knew the answer. It's not enough to be good at what you're teaching.
 
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For example, a high school band teacher has to be able to teach many instruments without really being an expert in most of them.

You can try to explain even to a gifted (from bass12's example) student about this/that "groove", but in order for the student to properly articulate (perform) that "groove", the student must master (to the required degree) the instrument.

P.S. I just have my opinion about those school bands and the reason why I have "that kind of" opinion about those school bands.
 
I've had beginner students whose ability to groove has been immediately evident. It didn't come after learning the notes on the fingerboard - it was already there.

"Groove" is there but without solid learning/training, it's kind of difficult to get that "groove" across.
Without mastering the instrument, it's difficult to "transfer" that internal groove into the "outer" Aural space.
 
It's the right note at the right time. When everyone is playing with the same concept. I've been in orchestras (on French horn) when the whole group (75 players) were all working together playing Shostakovitch and it was wonderful. I've been in jazz bands (on bass) playing a Basie chart and it was a mess as each note of each beat seemed to fight each other.
Groove (for lack of a better word) doesn't have to be any particular style. Jeff is totally correct about being the last thing. It is the pinnacle of playing... you can't possibly groove if there are ANY technical problems.
 
Disagree. You can create a great bass line with one note if it grooves.

One of the best bass lines I ever heard was from Zap Mama - playing a ceramic jug. The take home message to me was to stop being a bass player and start being a musician who plays bass notes.

IMO there are too many players who get so caught up in "learning the fretboard" they forget that they're supposed to be playing music.
 
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Having a sense of groove is not tied to playing bass. I've had beginner students whose ability to groove has been immediately evident. It didn't come after learning the notes on the fingerboard - it was already there.
True! Watching people clap in church or dancing the Chicken Dance at a party demonstrates the natural sense of 4/4 that most people have.

But in the learning/playing of music, your comment don't apply. You can test this out for yourself with your students:

Give your student an assignment where they will play a melody or bass line that is unfamiliar to them. Watch what takes place and notice that what you witnessed followed exactly the points of order that I listed above.
 
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I will have to agree with @JeffBerlin, the example of the assignment is good enough.

And on new generations it applies to other fields also.

I did not dedicated my time when I was young to learn the bass properly, with a proper music education. Now older, it is fascinating (and sometimes a pain) to understand things that facilitate playing bass, at least removing stress factors because you can now know what you are doing.

Since I was a kid I was in bands at school, so rythm is something I got early, even dancing, but from there, to have the proper knowledge and get a good balance between musical education and groove, it requires education, time, patience and practice.
 
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It's interesting that you say that. In the music I play, groove is useless. Even if I was the most groovy bassist ever, you wouldn't know it because none of the songs are focused on a feel that has groove. Controlling my timing in that band goes into making the songs feel more energetic.
 
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