RedSub Coliseum Fanned Fret 5-String Bass

[Paul Leech]

So I've been checking out multiscale basses since April/May of this year and – mainly because of the zombie apocalypse (ZA) we've been going through since early last year – it has not been an easy task. I was originally going to buy a 4 string Music Man Stingray because I played a few of them pre-ZA and I fell in love.

However, when I was finally really serious about buying, immediate availability was non-existent. There was no definitive date as to when they would be available, so I explored other options. Apparently living under a rock for the last 10 years, the term "multiscale" or "fanned fret" was not in my vocabulary. I forget where I first encountered one, but as soon as I was aware I became obsessed. I bought a 5 string Schecter well over 10 years ago, but I found that I hated the B string because it never sounded right. Always seemed flabby and out of tune, and not much fun to play. I traded that in at Guitar Center back in 2011-ish for an Ibanez SR370 that I still have and play frequently. As much as I wanted a 5 string I had all but given up on the thought of one until I found out about the multiscale option. The more I read, the more I thought, "hey, this seems viable". So I spent the next several months trying to find one that I would be happy with.

I had decided to go with the Spector NS Dimension Multi-Scale 5-String and I almost ordered one, but I decided to look for more user reviews and that's when I discovered a thread on here that details issues with the B string pickup coverage and that steered me away. I would have bought another Ibanez, but they don't seem to get the multiscale concept very well, since the length is less than ideal on their B strings.

I'd almost given up, when I decided to check out some of the cheaper options since it would be an easy way to check one out without spending $1500-2000 on an instrument that I might not be happy with. So, last Sunday I came to a decision to by the RedSub Coliseum 5-String. Unfortunately, they're only available from a place in the UK called Gear4Music. But I did some research and I ordered one last Monday. It arrived late Friday afternoon, and I'm really happy I decided to go for it! It's actually a well-made instrument and it plays way better than what I would have expected for the money ($424). I'm going to get back to playing it right now, but I'll be posting updates over the next few days as well as some recordings. Right now, I would have to say that I would highly recommend it to anyone thinking about a similar move. But we'll see how it goes after playing it for a while.

¦-þ

Disclaimer: Bass is not my main instrument, but I mainly record these days so I play frequently.​

 

[kesslari]

Nice looking instrument. Enjoy the new obsession!

 

[colan]

I'm looking at one now so I'm looking forward to your report.

 

[Paul Leech]

Update: I've been playing it for 4 days now and, other than my fingers being sore because I don't usually play bass this often, I'm happy to report that my initial impression remains unchanged if not even more so. The build quality is top notch: I haven't put it under the microscope yet, but I haven't noticed any defects worth mentioning. It holds tune even better than my Ibanez, which is impressive because that holds tune very well. Full transparency, I'm primarily a guitar player but I've always enjoyed playing bass and even played in a few bands way back in the day as a bass player. That being said, I suspect that I tend to approach bass from more of a chord-based perspective and this bass does not disappoint there either. Also, the sustain is impressive as well. When I finally get around to posting some sound bytes, I'll be sure to include some of those, too.

The only real complaint that I have has nothing to do with the instrument, but it's not a deal-breaker by any stretch: no documentation was included in the packaging when I received it from Gear4Music (G4M), so besides what little information is available on their website I'm a bit in the dark as far as what the knobs do. Here's what I do know:

1. Active/Passive (A/P) pull switch doubles as the volume control
2. Pickup blend
3. Bass
4. Mid
5. Treble

The first two are obvious enough and the tonal knobs should be easy enough to figure out but I would prefer not to have to guess. I emailed G4M to see if they have a PDF version of the manual, if one even exists. (If not, I offered to create one for them, being a currently unemployed web developer).

I've done a little recording with it, but not having any experience with A/P pickups I'm having a little trouble figuring out how to get an optimal sound from it. It still sounds good, but I know that I'm not fully utilizing it correctly. So it may take me a little longer than it would otherwise to post some recordings from it. I don't want to just throw something up that isn't a respectable representation of it. I use GarageBand a lot for initial recordings and one thing that I noticed right away is that the recording level picks up waaaaay better than my Ibanez does. I often have issues getting good levels recording guitar in GB, too, so I was a little surprised that this picks up so well. (There's no distortion or over-saturation in the recordings, for those that may be wondering). I suspect that it has something to do with the active pickup aspect, but it even gets a good level from the passive setting.

Overall, if you're thinking about buying one, I would wholeheartedly endorse that decision. The price for the bass was $424, which is awesome for an instrument of this quality. Sure, it's not a Dingwall (never played one, but I'm sure they're fantastic), but for an entry-level product you can't go wrong. I ordered it last Monday in the early AM and it arrived from the UK on Friday afternoon at my home (an hour NW of Chicago) just before 5PM CST. The carrier, DHL, delivered it in nearly pristine condition. It appeared to have been handled with care the entire trip, which is what I would hope for since they charge $100 for delivery! Still, $524 total is a great price. I may wind up replacing the pickups down the road, but apparently that won't be a problem because the current ones are similar enough dimension-wise making replacement trivial enough.

That's all for now!

 

[Paul Leech]

I'm looking at one now so I'm looking forward to your report.

Since you're in-country, the shipping should be much better than the $100 I had to pay. Looks like the nearest location is over 2 hours from where you're at, so I'm assuming you'll be ordering it online as well. For the price, you cannot go wrong.

 

[colan]

Thanks very much for that, Paul.
I did find a review which wasn't very complementary about the bass- but everybody's experiences differ, of course- and this guy certainly isn't my style of bassist- but what would you say about his comments that the bass is very uncomfortable ?

 

[colan]

Yes, shipping would be free for me. In fact, there's a bass I'd like at Sam Ash that I can't buy because they can't get a shipping quote to the UK. It's free for delivery inside the US. Maybe we should set up an international bass-exchange program to beat the shipping/tax problems .

 

[Paul Leech]

Thanks very much for that, Paul.
I did find a review which wasn't very complementary about the bass- but everybody's experiences differ, of course- and this guy certainly isn't my style of bassist- but what would you say about his comments that the bass is very uncomfortable ?

Thanks very much for that, Paul.
I did find a review which wasn't very complementary about the bass- but everybody's experiences differ, of course- and this guy certainly isn't my style of bassist- but what would you say about his comments that the bass is very uncomfortable ?

My response to the video:

• Moving the neck pickup closer to the neck is a legit beef, theoretically, at least. Just from a design standpoint, it doesn't make a lot of sense. I personally would have moved it closer to the neck, but I can't say definitively that it's a major faux pas. I don't think it has a devastatingly negative effect on the sound; Nothing to that extreme. Does it not provide an optimal blend of both pickups? Probably not. But also not a deal-breaker IMHO. And as always, your mileage may vary (YMMV) (Or, in your case Colin, your kilometers may vary).

• He's right about the B having a nice growl to it. I would totally agree with that and also add that it sounds *much*, much better than the Schecter 5 string that I bought back around 2011 and then sold about a year later. This one doesn't have that flabby feel to it and it sounds in tune to me as I'm playing it, for the most part. I should also add that I don't always play it plugged in (watching TV or just as a quick break while I'm working on the computer) and then it's hard to tell if it's in tune because the notes are so frakking low. There's a reason that basses (upright and electric) were all originally built with 4 strings. Anything lower really needs to be amplified in order to generate the proper frequencies.

• I should also add that I primarily play with my fingers and only use a pick on certain songs or styles (like the Violent Femmes or metal) and I also slap on a lot of my original tunes and some RHCP songs. He only uses a pick, from what I saw in the video, so he's missing out on a lot of what this bass has to offer. Playing "The Real Me" by the Who, for instance, is a real treat cuz this bass sounds awesome and nails that infamous Entwistle finger-slapping style (as opposed to more traditional thumb-slapping style) growl really well, IMHO. I'll include some excerpts from it in my audio upload when I put that out so you can judge for yourself. Again, YMMV/YKMV.

• Multiscale - Low frets: As far as the multiscale (MS) feel on the lower frets, I haven't played any other MS basses to compare it against, but the neck/string length is longer than my Ibanez (the low B is 36.25" on the RedSub and all the strings on the Ibanez are 34") and it is a bit of a reach to get to the first and second frets at first, but I don't really notice it now that I've gotten used to it. For instance, again playing The Real Me, there is a point where you're up on the 13th-17th frets followed by a fast, semi-chromatic open E-F-F#-G A-A#-B-C run and that's no problem. Plus, I can't see how this could be problematic of this RedSub MS bass in particular since it seems to have more to do with the string length in general.

• Multiscale - High frets: He also complains about the fan on the higher frets but I totally disagree with that assessment. It took me all of about a minute to feel at home playing the higher frets and I spend a LOT of time around and above the 12th fret. I also play a lot of chords up high (think "Don't Give Up" by Peter Gabriel) and I think it really shines in that aspect. I also have an original that I wrote that uses 3 note chords almost exclusively on the upper frets and there is no issue at all with that song, so...

• Tuners: The reviewer thinks the tuners are total garbage. While I agree that they're not what you would find in the $2K+ basses and I may eventually replace them, however, they do the job that they're intended to quite well. This bass holds tune extremely well. I played it for 2 full days without having to tune it, so I really can't complain about that.

• Flawed Overall Design: Towards the end of the video, he assesses the total cost with shipping to be over $500 ($525 for mine) and he seems to recommend that you could buy a used Ibanez for only a few hundred more, which is definitely true, If you wanted to go that route, it would be hard to disagree. I love my Ibanez SR370 and would recommend it to anyone looking for a quality bass for less than $500. However, in terms of multiscale, I really think that Ibanez doesn't really get the whole concept. A 35.5" B string fails to capitalize on the reason that multiscale instruments were created in the first place. A 37" B string seems to be the universally agreed upon length in order to achieve the best results, and 36.25" is a helluva lot closer than 35.5". Everyone is entitled to their opinion, of course, but I think he's being pretty harsh here.

Final Assessment: The reviewer makes some legitimate points, but the quality of the product in comparison with the overall cost, makes the instrument a decision I don't see myself regretting. But again, one last YMMV/YKMV.

One final point that I would like to make is that during the zombie apocalypse that we've been going thru for the last year and half, MS bass production overall has fallen on hard times. Almost any MS bass you might be thinking of purchasing has an extended lead time and I was getting tired of waiting. So if (nearly) instant gratification is a thing, like it can be for me, that made this an even easier decision.

 

[colan]

That's a really detailed and useful critique, Paul- thank you.
As Gear4Music will accept returns within 14 days, post-paid, I'm inclined to buy the RedSub just to ascertain the usefulness of fan frets in my own playing development . Should it turn out that the quality of the B string tone and volume are as markedly superior as other reviewers state then that will be an advantage in itself, although the B on my Human Base Roxy 5 is clear and powerful without amplification. Coming from a folk/country thumbed acoustic guitar background my 5-string basses have already led me into frequently writing in B so that open B string is very important to me.
Also, the placement of the RedSub neck pickup suits me as I tend to play just behind the fretboard end.
Thanks again. I'll let you know what transpires.

 

[Paul Leech]

That's a really detailed and useful critique, Paul- thank you.
As Gear4Music will accept returns within 14 days, post-paid, I'm inclined to buy the RedSub just to ascertain the usefulness of fan frets in my own playing development . Should it turn out that the quality of the B string tone and volume are as markedly superior as other reviewers state then that will be an advantage in itself, although the B on my Human Base Roxy 5 is clear and powerful without amplification.

I wouldn't go quite so far as to make any exceptional claims about the B; I would say it's passable and at least acceptable to my expectations after the previous experience I had with that Schecter. I'm not blown away by it, at least. Let me just say that. I just checked out a video of Ed Friedland playing a Human Base Roxy 5. Nice looking instrument!

I should also confess that I'm not conditioned to play the B string very much yet, since there's still a bit of an adjustment period with it. As happy as I am with the bass, I'm thinking about buying one of their 7 string SubZero electrics. Now that I've played a fanned fret, I'm definitely interested in picking up a FF guitar with a low B as well. That might lead me into writing material that utilizes the B more which would seemingly translate to the 5 string bass.

Coming from a folk/country thumbed acoustic guitar background my 5-string basses have already led me into frequently writing in B so that open B string is very important to me.

Is B a popular key for that genre? I played some folk with a friend of mine who liked it when I was younger, but have almost zero country experience.

Also, the placement of the RedSub neck pickup suits me as I tend to play just behind the fretboard end.
Thanks again. I'll let you know what transpires.

Sounds good. Let me know what you think of it, if you end up getting one.

 

[Paul Leech]

Neck Dive: for those of you wondering, there is no appreciable neck dive on this bass.

Weight: It is a tad bit heavier than my Ibanez and if I was to play it during a 3 hour gig like I used to back in the day, it could get a bit uncomfortable. But that's not an issue for me. If I were to ever play it live, it would be only a few songs at most, so...

 

[Paul Leech]

Yes, shipping would be free for me. In fact, there's a bass I'd like at Sam Ash that I can't buy because they can't get a shipping quote to the UK. It's free for delivery inside the US. Maybe we should set up an international bass-exchange program to beat the shipping/tax problems .

Ha! I'd probably wind up with a coalition of FedEx/DHL thugs at my front door looking to teach me a lesson!

 

[colan]

I'm not at all concerned about what's ' popular ', Paul, in any genre

Yes, the Ed Friedland critique of the Roxy 5 is excellent. Mine's a keeper, as is my Ibanez GWB 205 fretless. Since I got the Roxy 5 I haven't picked up my Precision at all- although that's a keeper too and I know I should.

OK- I'm mulling the RedSub.

 

[kodiakblair]

@colan

UK thread on the RedSub from nearly 3 years back.

Cheap Fan Fret

 

[colan]

Thanks, Kodiakblair.

 

[Paul Leech]

@colan

UK thread on the RedSub from nearly 3 years back.

Cheap Fan Fret

Thanks for posting this thread, @kodiakbear . Just checked it out and it looks like both of the guys that bought one (a 5 & a 6 string) were quite happy with their purchases. The guy that was looking to buy one from eBay was making a mistake, IMHO. The price difference just isn't worth it unless they're practically giving it away. Still very happy with mine. Played it for about an hour and a half. Updated the firmware on my Spark Amp. Probably do some recording on it to post here. Worked on the solo for Please Do Not Go by the Violent Femmes. If you've never heard that song, give it a listen. Maybe my favorite bass solo of all time.

 

[Paul Leech]

My response to the video:

• Moving the neck pickup closer to the neck is a legit beef, theoretically, at least. Just from a design standpoint, it doesn't make a lot of sense. I personally would have moved it closer to the neck, but I can't say definitively that it's a major faux pas. I don't think it has a devastatingly negative effect on the sound; Nothing to that extreme. Does it not provide an optimal blend of both pickups? Probably not. But also not a deal-breaker IMHO. And as always, your mileage may vary (YMMV) (Or, in your case Colin, your kilometers may vary).

• He's right about the B having a nice growl to it. I would totally agree with that and also add that it sounds *much*, much better than the Schecter 5 string that I bought back around 2011 and then sold about a year later. This one doesn't have that flabby feel to it and it sounds in tune to me as I'm playing it, for the most part. I should also add that I don't always play it plugged in (watching TV or just as a quick break while I'm working on the computer) and then it's hard to tell if it's in tune because the notes are so frakking low. There's a reason that basses (upright and electric) were all originally built with 4 strings. Anything lower really needs to be amplified in order to generate the proper frequencies.

• I should also add that I primarily play with my fingers and only use a pick on certain songs or styles (like the Violent Femmes or metal) and I also slap on a lot of my original tunes and some RHCP songs. He only uses a pick, from what I saw in the video, so he's missing out on a lot of what this bass has to offer. Playing "The Real Me" by the Who, for instance, is a real treat cuz this bass sounds awesome and nails that infamous Entwistle finger-slapping style (as opposed to more traditional thumb-slapping style) growl really well, IMHO. I'll include some excerpts from it in my audio upload when I put that out so you can judge for yourself. Again, YMMV/YKMV.

• Multiscale - Low frets: As far as the multiscale (MS) feel on the lower frets, I haven't played any other MS basses to compare it against, but the neck/string length is longer than my Ibanez (the low B is 36.25" on the RedSub and all the strings on the Ibanez are 34") and it is a bit of a reach to get to the first and second frets at first, but I don't really notice it now that I've gotten used to it. For instance, again playing The Real Me, there is a point where you're up on the 13th-17th frets followed by a fast, semi-chromatic open E-F-F#-G A-A#-B-C run and that's no problem. Plus, I can't see how this could be problematic of this RedSub MS bass in particular since it seems to have more to do with the string length in general.

• Multiscale - High frets: He also complains about the fan on the higher frets but I totally disagree with that assessment. It took me all of about a minute to feel at home playing the higher frets and I spend a LOT of time around and above the 12th fret. I also play a lot of chords up high (think "Don't Give Up" by Peter Gabriel) and I think it really shines in that aspect. I also have an original that I wrote that uses 3 note chords almost exclusively on the upper frets and there is no issue at all with that song, so...

• Tuners: The reviewer thinks the tuners are total garbage. While I agree that they're not what you would find in the $2K+ basses and I may eventually replace them, however, they do the job that they're intended to quite well. This bass holds tune extremely well. I played it for 2 full days without having to tune it, so I really can't complain about that.

• Flawed Overall Design: Towards the end of the video, he assesses the total cost with shipping to be over $500 ($525 for mine) and he seems to recommend that you could buy a used Ibanez for only a few hundred more, which is definitely true, If you wanted to go that route, it would be hard to disagree. I love my Ibanez SR370 and would recommend it to anyone looking for a quality bass for less than $500. However, in terms of multiscale, I really think that Ibanez doesn't really get the whole concept. A 35.5" B string fails to capitalize on the reason that multiscale instruments were created in the first place. A 37" B string seems to be the universally agreed upon length in order to achieve the best results, and 36.25" is a helluva lot closer than 35.5". Everyone is entitled to their opinion, of course, but I think he's being pretty harsh here.

Final Assessment: The reviewer makes some legitimate points, but the quality of the product in comparison with the overall cost, makes the instrument a decision I don't see myself regretting. But again, one last YMMV/YKMV.

One final point that I would like to make is that during the zombie apocalypse that we've been going thru for the last year and half, MS bass production overall has fallen on hard times. Almost any MS bass you might be thinking of purchasing has an extended lead time and I was getting tired of waiting. So if (nearly) instant gratification is a thing, like it can be for me, that made this an even easier decision.

Thanks very much for that, Paul.
I did find a review which wasn't very complementary about the bass- but everybody's experiences differ, of course- and this guy certainly isn't my style of bassist- but what would you say about his comments that the bass is very uncomfortable ?

Not sure if I ever answered your question about the bass being very uncomfortable to play or not, like the reviewer seemed to think, so I figured I would address it now: I don't agree that it's uncomfortable to play at all. That being said, I should add the caveat that I have not played any other MS/FF basses so I don't have that experience to compare to. However, I frequently play this bass for over an hour at a time with no more issues than I do on my Ibanez while playing for the similar periods of time. Of course, like always, YMMV. I would be curious if anyone else has an opportunity to play one of these, if they wouldn't mind sharing their experience with it.

 

[Paul Leech]

Update: It's been 2 weeks since the instrument arrived from the UK and my opinion hasn't changed. For the money spent, I truly believe this to be an outstanding purchase. It still holds tune remarkably well, which is surprising considering that the tuners are hardly top-of-the-line, by any stretch. But they're definitely adequate, and hold up under countless hours of playing very well. I'm planning on doing some recording with it this week so I hope to be posting that on here shortly thereafter.

One complaint that I do have, which I don't recall if I've mentioned yet, is the pots are a little rough. They feel gritty when I'm turning them. I need to remember to track down my contact cleaner and give them a spritzing. Otherwise, I'll hit it with the ole trusty snake oil solution WD-40. They may very well discover it cures cancer one day, because it does just about everything else (including maybe cause cancer, but I digress...).

 

[Paul Leech]

UPDATE: Over a month later, everything is still going well. Started using it to record some parts on 3 new songs I've been developing and I'm happy with the way it sounds in the mix. It really seems to cut through without any additional effort required. More so than my Ibanez does, IMHO.

One thing that I don't like – and I don't think I've mentioned it yet – is the minimalist dot deployment on the fretboard (see image above). I have a guitar that uses the same pattern and I'm not a fan. Unless there's a big savings gained from it, I just can't get behind the thought process. It makes guesswork out of something that should be a no-brainer as you're playing it. Don't make me work any harder than I would need to if the traditional dot pattern were used instead. That split-second of indecision sliding up and down the neck trying to figure out exactly where you are becomes aggravating during recording. I never have to worry about getting my bearings on other instruments that employ the traditional approach. This is not just a RedSub issue, I realize, but it does have a slight negative impact of my overall impression of the instrument.

 

[colan]

I stick a thin strip of flourescent tape to the side of my fretboard markers, as the 12th fret marker in your photo, above. Works a treat. Maybe have to replace one or two every couple of months- but no biggie.