What's the current thought on using charts for live shows?

[Core Creek]

Many great comments. If your band is cool with charts, then use them. The more you play the songs, the less reading you'll have to do.

My 2¢: I juggle a half-dozen regular bands and do sub gigs on top of that. One band is all original, another is female-fronted covers. Even with the remaining male-fronted cover bands, there's only partial overlap between sets. So, for the better part of a decade I've been using a tablet for almost every gig I play. It's an Android tablet with the Setlist Helper app. The app now contains nearly 700 songs split among 20 different band setlists. Some of those bands have no doubt broken up, but I've used a dozen of my band setlists within the past couple/few years.

Context: mainly bar gigs. I always ask a new BL whether charts are OK, and the answer has always been "sure. whatever works". I have occasionally used actual chord charts in iReal Pro, but 98% of the time I'm using my handwritten charts in Setlist Helper. I use SLH as a glorified text editor, cobbling out the song structure in my simplified version of the Nashville Number system*. Nearly all the time, the chart will fit on one screen.

IMPORTANT: I'm not reading every song! For any band I perform with regularly, I only read a couple/few songs per set, mainly recent additions. Also, unless the song is brand new to me or one I haven't played in a long time, I only need a quick glance or two at the chart to remind me of the structure. I'm hardly ever nose-down in my tablet for a song, and I've developed the ability to quickly adjust on the fly if a band plays a song differently than I've charted it.


* OK, here's an example of my number shorthand. It's not perfect... e.g. it doesn't say how many repetitions of the verse pattern. But I don't need perfection, I have ears. It's a super simple song, but the only time I played was at a sub gig. So, I jotted it down for that one gig, and it remains in my tablet for future reference along with many, many others.

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I agree that charts are more “guides”. Or quick refreshers. I often write the chord (or just note) changes for a verse and chorus and bridge, but then just write “same” for verse 2 or such. And sometimes it’s not the same and that’s where charts are useful.

Here are a couple of mine. I just used the Bob Marley one this past weekend having not played it since last summer:

Build me up Buttercup was one of those songs I had a mental block on. I hate it.. passionately. So I had to stick to the chart for far longer than I should have. But after 7 months of regular play I finally got it. Plus the “GOTO brown eyed girl” was important since we don’t stop between them.

 

[Fuzzbass]

I agree that charts are more “guides”. Or quick refreshers. I often write the chord (or just note) changes for a verse and chorus and bridge, but then just write “same” for verse 2 or such. And sometimes it’s not the same and that’s where charts are useful.

Here are a couple of mine. I just used the Bob Marley one this past weekend having not played it since last summer:

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Build me up Buttercup was one of those songs I had a mental block on. I hate it.. passionately. So I had to stick to the chart for far longer than I should have. But after 7 months of regular play I finally got it. Plus the “GOTO brown eyed girl” was important since we don’t stop between them.

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Cool! Your handwritten charts carry a whole lot more info than my ASCII-based ones. Great job with the tab, I rarely write out anything more difficult than "box shuffle", "1356 pattern".

I have a Galaxy tablet with a stylus that I don't use. I don't know if there's an Android equivalent of forScore, but TBH, I haven't looked very hard. I've been using my current routine for years, and the thought of converting nearly 700 charts to a completely different format is daunting.



P.S. Not a fan of "...Buttercup" either. A friend's band does that one, and I was afraid he'd bring it into a different band we played in together for awhile.

 

[Core Creek]

Cool! Your handwritten charts carry a whole lot more info than my ASCII-based ones. Great job with the tab, I rarely write out anything more difficult than "box shuffle", "1356 pattern".

I have a Galaxy tablet with a stylus that I don't use. I don't know if there's an Android equivalent of forScore, but TBH, I haven't looked very hard. I've been using my current routine for years, and the thought of converting nearly 700 charts to a completely different format is daunting.



P.S. Not a fan of "...Buttercup" either. A friend's band does that one, and I was afraid he'd bring it into a different band we played in together for awhile.

I found this great product called Rocket Book. It’s a reusable notebook that has a scanner app. You write in the notebook using erasable ink and just a dab of water erases mistakes. When I’m ready to clear the whole page I just use a damp cloth and presto, a new blank sheet.

Before erasing the app lets you scan the page and import into pretty much anything - acrobat, saved files, etc. I just put into a Dropbox folder - different folders for different bands, and one master folder that has all the charts - I’m a little over 600.

The downfall is if I need to edit a chart after I erased it from the notebook I either need to rewrite it (which isn’t so bad because I have the original scan to work off of) or I can screenshot the chart and use an electronic pen and hand write the changes and resave it.

It works for me. Yeah, changing over is daunting. For a few weeks Dropbox got rid of its fast tab that let you scroll through the alphabet real quick. I almost abandoned it. But enough people complained that they reintroduced it. Without it I would have to scroll through all 300 songs to get from one end to the other. Now I hit the fast tab and I can instantly scroll though the alphabet- so
much faster. But still our BL leaves so little time between songs that I’m usually scrolling a little in the prior song to get myself ready for the next song - sort of
like “what key does that start on again? I better find it before this song ends”…

 

[Fuzzbass]

I found this great product called Rocket Book.

Looking at it now on Amazon. Impressive product, and your testimonial speaks loudly. I will spend some time wrapping my brain around it. Thanks!

 

[robassable]

Rock/country/bob bands using charts, especially with music stands, from the audience perspective looks pretty cheesy, and most everyone I play with that rely heavily on them rarely memorize, and always have their face in it. More acceptable for jazz/classical, but always better to memorize the tunes, as to better engage with the audience. Even though I am a pretty good chart reader, I prefer to put in the extra effort to memorize the tune in the first place, time permitting of course. A side benefit of this is you get really good at memorizing tunes and chord structures.

 

[ryco]

Rock/pop/R&B/country = no charts
Jazz = charts OK, pisses off the "ear" cats, though.

 

[Ggaa]

I'll use one if there's a song I don't know well enough(subbing especially), don't need it for long though. Usually a spiral notebook, on the floor, written with a Sharpie.

 

[pepj]

Got a gig recently as BL said of the old bass player that he relied on ipads too much.
Can see both sides of story but choice is simple, if you need one to stop screwing up a song, then do it.
Mine are more notes, like bass in after 8 and the chord to enter the m8 etc....because even though you kind of know the song, these little 'cheats' do help.

 

[Fuzzbass]

Rock/country/bob bands using charts, especially with music stands, from the audience perspective looks pretty cheesy, and most everyone I play with that rely heavily on them rarely memorize, and always have their face in it.

IMO it depends on the venue. For higher paying gigs in premier venues, I agree that a music stand or even tablet stand looks cheesy. For routine bar/restaurant/coffee house gigs, I think tablet stands are fine: they aren't that intrusive, and the audience tends to care more about the songs being played than whatever band is playing them.

Got a gig recently as BL said of the old bass player that he relied on ipads too much.
Can see both sides of story but choice is simple, if you need one to stop screwing up a song, then do it.
Mine are more notes, like bass in after 8 and the chord to enter the m8 etc....because even though you kind of know the song, these little 'cheats' do help.

Funny you mention: I juggle a bunch of bands that often juggle sidemen depending on availability. As it happens, I've heard stories about one of my bassist peers: I've never met him, but he's subbed for me and I've subbed for him. We both will use charts as needed, but apparently he can become so focused on the chart that he doesn't always adjust when the band doesn't follow the map that he's written out. That brings up an important rule of using charts/notes/cheat sheets, especially when subbing with a new band: keep your ears open, and be prepared to adapt on the fly as needed.

Most of my charts are simplified Nashville numbers, but some are just text comments, same as yours. They can contain things like "Band X adds a verse after the solo", "Band Y plays this in the key of C instead of D", "Band Z stops after the 2nd chorus and launches into _____ _____" (a different song).

 

[Pocket Dave]

... As it happens, I've heard stories about one of my bassist peers: I've never met him, but he's subbed for me and I've subbed for him. We both will use charts as needed, but apparently he can become so focused on the chart that he doesn't always adjust when the band doesn't follow the map that he's written out. That brings up an important rule of using charts/notes/cheat sheets, especially when subbing with a new band: keep your ears open, and be prepared to adapt on the fly as needed.

Most of my charts are simplified Nashville numbers, but some are just text comments, same as yours. They can contain things like "Band X adds a verse after the solo", "Band Y plays this in the key of C instead of D", "Band Z stops after the 2nd chorus and launches into _____ _____" (a different song).

Yep. Sounds like your bassist peer keeps his head buried in charts to where he's not able to engage with the BL and band. Guessing he also comes across disengaged from the audience, one of my pet peeves with over-reliance of charts on stage - It's painful for me to be in the crowd watching.

 

[fdeck]

That's a symptom of weak reading skill.

I think there are a lot of playing skills that are similar in this way: They're optional, but if you choose to use them, then you're obligated to learn how to use them right: Reading, playing fretless in tune, being trusted with a loud amp, playing any kind of drums.

Using charts on stage means not letting them interfere with the performance. This is true even in classical music.

 

[pklima]

You know who wishes I would use charts? Photographers. After Sunday, one told me it's so nice how our singer is actually lit properly, and I was hard to photograph because my skin looks weird purple. The venue thought it would be cool to have blue stage lights, but the singer had a tablet, so... Of course on the way home the singer was talking about turning the brightness on the tablet down so it's easier on her eyes and also makes her less bright in photos.

 

[Fuzzbass]

You know who wishes I would use charts? Photographers. After Sunday, one told me it's so nice how our singer is actually lit properly, and I was hard to photograph because my skin looks weird purple. The venue thought it would be cool to have blue stage lights, but the singer had a tablet, so... Of course on the way home the singer was talking about turning the brightness on the tablet down so it's easier on her eyes and also makes her less bright in photos.

Ha. The solution to your singer's concern about ghostly appearance: dark mode!