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As mentioned before, nothing criminally wrong with SWR as a whole - every line has its good and bad points. The trend in the market now is smaller, lighter, louder, and cheaper than anything SWR offered, and people voted with their wallets.
Perhaps the biggest issue in terms of design was the fact that there was no built-in HPF on the big SWR heads. This caused a lot of heat buildup as the amp struggled to reproduce ultra-low frequencies that can’t really be heard.
The original SWR amplifier was designed to behave like a huge recording studio monitor. It had more in common with a mixing desk than it did with an Ampeg. This was a great sound for those seeking a very clean hi-fi tone. This sound is completely out of fashion now, and the amp line that led the charge on it followed suit.
Perhaps the biggest issue in terms of design was the fact that there was no built-in HPF on the big SWR heads. This caused a lot of heat buildup as the amp struggled to reproduce ultra-low frequencies that can’t really be heard.
The original SWR amplifier was designed to behave like a huge recording studio monitor. It had more in common with a mixing desk than it did with an Ampeg. This was a great sound for those seeking a very clean hi-fi tone. This sound is completely out of fashion now, and the amp line that led the charge on it followed suit.
it's steve rabe style amp.. from what I was told at the time.. like the other too.. but I too found that to be true.. that's why I made the choice I made.. 15 years ago..
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Having gigged a SWR 750 head through a hartke 410 and ampeg 810 for about 17 years, I can honestly say I no longer like SWR amps.
It was reliable. But I disliked it more with each passing year. If I had had the money, I would have replaced it sooner. Based on whats available today, I wouldn't touch SWR anymore. I eventually replaced it when it started making weird intermittent static noise.
It sounded good, sure, thats why I bought it. The tone was as everyone says, clear and scooped-ish. It was great for active basses, but passive basses sounded plain through it so I used a VT bass pedal with my passives. One thing no one mentions, maybe its me, but at higher volumes, the low end, while sounding great, was always the dominant sound of this amp, and other SWR amps I've used. Like it couldnt articulate mids and highs passed a certain point. Sometimes I feel like it was the best amp for reggae tones, but playing in a rock band was just not the right setting. I did find that high end disappeared when played through my ampeg 810, I'm guessing the amp was designed to work with tweeters, of which the ampeg has none.
I never understood the aural enhancer control. In the years I owned it, i never moved it from the 1o'clock position, it just didn't sound good in any other setting. Pointless.
When the preamp clipped, it sounded like crap, and I could never get the gain passed 12o'clock. The limiter circuit was very sensitive causing pumping and drained tone quality, so I almost always had it disengaged. This head also had one of the worst sounding effects loops I've encountered, so I never used it.
The power switch was weird sometimes, but that could have just been mine.
It came with a proprietary footswitch with a five pin connector. It should have been a trs cable or unbalanced connector. I damaged one of the pins and was never able to use the footswitch again.
My biggest pet peeve of this amp: I always felt it was way underpowered. I mean, it could get real loud but for an amp that said 750 watts right on the front, it was a wuss. It pretty much stopped outputting volume after the master reached the 12o'clock position, right when I needed it to, even at 4ohms.
My Quilter BB800 smokes it in the volume department, and only weighs 3 pounds. That is no understatement, I could hardly believe it when I played it through my 810 for the first time.
Nothing wrong with SWR, there are just better choices now.
It was reliable. But I disliked it more with each passing year. If I had had the money, I would have replaced it sooner. Based on whats available today, I wouldn't touch SWR anymore. I eventually replaced it when it started making weird intermittent static noise.
It sounded good, sure, thats why I bought it. The tone was as everyone says, clear and scooped-ish. It was great for active basses, but passive basses sounded plain through it so I used a VT bass pedal with my passives. One thing no one mentions, maybe its me, but at higher volumes, the low end, while sounding great, was always the dominant sound of this amp, and other SWR amps I've used. Like it couldnt articulate mids and highs passed a certain point. Sometimes I feel like it was the best amp for reggae tones, but playing in a rock band was just not the right setting. I did find that high end disappeared when played through my ampeg 810, I'm guessing the amp was designed to work with tweeters, of which the ampeg has none.
I never understood the aural enhancer control. In the years I owned it, i never moved it from the 1o'clock position, it just didn't sound good in any other setting. Pointless.
When the preamp clipped, it sounded like crap, and I could never get the gain passed 12o'clock. The limiter circuit was very sensitive causing pumping and drained tone quality, so I almost always had it disengaged. This head also had one of the worst sounding effects loops I've encountered, so I never used it.
The power switch was weird sometimes, but that could have just been mine.
It came with a proprietary footswitch with a five pin connector. It should have been a trs cable or unbalanced connector. I damaged one of the pins and was never able to use the footswitch again.
My biggest pet peeve of this amp: I always felt it was way underpowered. I mean, it could get real loud but for an amp that said 750 watts right on the front, it was a wuss. It pretty much stopped outputting volume after the master reached the 12o'clock position, right when I needed it to, even at 4ohms.
My Quilter BB800 smokes it in the volume department, and only weighs 3 pounds. That is no understatement, I could hardly believe it when I played it through my 810 for the first time.
Nothing wrong with SWR, there are just better choices now.
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I had an early SS-160 or maybee it was a ss-180 i don't remember ,it was one of ,if not the first SWR production amps and it had a low end response that was not availabe in any SWR made after it , i believe it was considered incompatible with RIAA recording standards which was the motivation for removing that low end from future models ,I know I talked to Steve Rabe about it once and he'd said something to that effect , I could get a bass to sound like a church organ bass pedal with that amp , amazingly clean deep and phat ,used it with an early swr Triad cabinet,the early ones were the most physically heavy cabs ,what a combination! , if the cab hadn't weighed a hundred pounds ...literally....I'd probably still be using it,years later sold the amp on ebay to someone in Russia ,the cab went to a friend for his home back line .................just thankful for neodynium..lol
I still use and love my SWR cabs, not so much their amps.
However, the issue with SWR is they got stuck in their own legacy while the market was moving ahead. They came up way too late with their lightweight class D amp, neo cabs, while others were already selling it since a while. It was way too late when they decided to wake up from their long nap.
Also, their is this pre-Fender era. To me this is total BS. I have owned both pre and post Fender era cabs, and both where as good the others. I'm talking about the Goliath II and III cabs mainly.
However, the issue with SWR is they got stuck in their own legacy while the market was moving ahead. They came up way too late with their lightweight class D amp, neo cabs, while others were already selling it since a while. It was way too late when they decided to wake up from their long nap.
Also, their is this pre-Fender era. To me this is total BS. I have owned both pre and post Fender era cabs, and both where as good the others. I'm talking about the Goliath II and III cabs mainly.
I used a Workingman's 350 at a couple gigs as a loaner. It seemed to be either underpowered or voiced in such a way that it just didn't cut very well. I don't remember much about the sound beyond struggling to be heard (and it was the same wattage as the head it was replacing).
On the other hand, back when you could have a blues jam, one of the local jams used a Hartke 1000 into an SWR 115 of some sort, and that was a really nice sounding combination
On the other hand, back when you could have a blues jam, one of the local jams used a Hartke 1000 into an SWR 115 of some sort, and that was a really nice sounding combination
I also used a Basic Red head I bought new and a 2x10 Goliath II Jr for about 20 years of pub gigs. I still use the Cab for a house gig and I gave the head to a young upstart that is still using it. Once I found a head that could fit in my gig bag I was not looking back. But for the young and strong that gear is very good.
I've always dreamed of a bass 'twin reverb', and the Redhead and follow-on Super Redhead were pretty close. What with the vast improvements in cab and speaker performance, and the light Class D amps, I wish someone ( . . . and boy, do I know a guy . . . .) would revisit this format using contemporary design and components, and done with 12's instead of 10's could be truly impressive if the required and resulting weights/dimensions didn't make it into a white elephant.
Post #3 pretty much nails it.
Bi-amping with an 18” and a small driver/whizzy is about as sensible as bi-amping for bass will ever get.
If you ever decide to go out gigging check out Bergantino.
SWR had some really amazing-looking products - their designs were cool. Lots of bells and whistles and stuff, but whenever I tried them out I always felt they lacked a bit of mid punch. You could get a good sound out of them but it took work. Since I mostly play metal, I need strong mids, and I tend to gravitate towards amps with a more baked-in sound, or at least ones where you can leave everything flat and mostly have a workable sound. SWR didn't do it for me, really. But lots of people liked them, so YMMV I guess.
wmhill
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Other than the weight, absolutely nothing wrong with SWR- I used the cabs for years. (I didn't care much for the cheaper workingman cabs.)
All the stuff I used is still gigging with a friend that doesn't mind the heft. With the chrome grills, it was some of the best looking gear ever.
All the stuff I used is still gigging with a friend that doesn't mind the heft. With the chrome grills, it was some of the best looking gear ever.
Old electronic gear is generally less reliable than newer gear - power supplies need new parts, etc.
In some cases, there are enough people that still love it (and are willing to deal with maintenance, etc) that the limited (dwindling) supply isn’t enough to satisfy the demand. Prices rise.
In other cases, if the number of units still out there exceeds the number of fans, prices drop. This thread has established rational reasons that some have moved on, but also that there are still fans. Falling prices means there aren’t enough of them.
In some cases, there are enough people that still love it (and are willing to deal with maintenance, etc) that the limited (dwindling) supply isn’t enough to satisfy the demand. Prices rise.
In other cases, if the number of units still out there exceeds the number of fans, prices drop. This thread has established rational reasons that some have moved on, but also that there are still fans. Falling prices means there aren’t enough of them.