Jason’s bass is gorgeous and there are many good points in this thread. I may be an outlier, but I am still happy with the bass I bought for $6k in 2005. Whatever it can’t do, I blame the player for.
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Double Bass Expensive basses
- Thread starter wmannerland
- Start date
I got the bass I still play in 1964. I've owned others that I used for different circumstances but finally realized this one would serve in almost all situations and would make my life much simpler. I settled on a hybrid string after many comparisons and accepted the fact that a good sounding, solid instrument that was healthy and reasonably weather and humidity tolerant would be the best choice for me. As a freelancer I needed an instrument I could count on to sound good and hold together in the various situations I would find myself in. I also am one of those people who would not want a really expensive car or watch or anything that I would have to be concerned about using day-to-day. I have no real idea about how much my bass is worth and I don't think I want to know. It's a tool I know I can rely on.
My Mirecourt bass is a 5/8th’s size. It has no significant repairs. It’s sloping shoulders and neck profile are comfortable.
It sounds nice on recordings. Over the years I’ve entertained the thought of buying a new bass, but I’m thankful
for the one I have. If I won the lottery I’d look at new basses built by some one like Nick Lloyd.Just my take
It sounds nice on recordings. Over the years I’ve entertained the thought of buying a new bass, but I’m thankful
for the one I have. If I won the lottery I’d look at new basses built by some one like Nick Lloyd.Just my take
I tried a bunch of basses today. Recorded some videos. Anyone interested in hearing and giving some thoughts?
A really good bass does a lot of the work for you.
Not only is my Pollmann easier to practice on as it requires less effort to get a decent sound and tone, but the volume is a by-product. (The hardware, fingerboard, tailpiece tuners etc are also top quality and give less trouble)
Only when I got the Pollmann did the cellists start to look around, did the conductor signal to me to lower the volume with an angry, pained expression and a bass teacher unknown to me, picked me out at a concert and was asking "who was that guy?" (for better or worse!! Nobody used to notice me!)
A cellist once said to me that she feels her toes are being massaged when I play. (No! I ran that one through, it wasn't a flirt!).
My bass really is better than I am, and gives me a clear advantage if I can hit the notes.
Before that I had a really good 3/4 Korean Universal bass, fully carved for about $1500.
My teacher said they were great value, but there was no comparison. It sounded like a muted saw!
What I will say about my Pollmann is I don't feel it so much. It doesn't come alive in my hands or vibrate much.
Apparently they are quite heavily built, even those designed for only 4 strings. (Some of their 4 stringers have 5 string bodies, which are heavier but can be upgraded easily.)
I wouldn't have realised it was so loud and powerful were it not for the feedback.
+1 for taking someone with you to stand away from the bass. Sound projection is hard to detect otherwise.
Not only is my Pollmann easier to practice on as it requires less effort to get a decent sound and tone, but the volume is a by-product. (The hardware, fingerboard, tailpiece tuners etc are also top quality and give less trouble)
Only when I got the Pollmann did the cellists start to look around, did the conductor signal to me to lower the volume with an angry, pained expression and a bass teacher unknown to me, picked me out at a concert and was asking "who was that guy?" (for better or worse!! Nobody used to notice me!)
A cellist once said to me that she feels her toes are being massaged when I play. (No! I ran that one through, it wasn't a flirt!).
My bass really is better than I am, and gives me a clear advantage if I can hit the notes.
Before that I had a really good 3/4 Korean Universal bass, fully carved for about $1500.
My teacher said they were great value, but there was no comparison. It sounded like a muted saw!
What I will say about my Pollmann is I don't feel it so much. It doesn't come alive in my hands or vibrate much.
Apparently they are quite heavily built, even those designed for only 4 strings. (Some of their 4 stringers have 5 string bodies, which are heavier but can be upgraded easily.)
I wouldn't have realised it was so loud and powerful were it not for the feedback.
+1 for taking someone with you to stand away from the bass. Sound projection is hard to detect otherwise.
6K is getting into a good range for a bass with a specific sound you want, especially non-classical. Even in the 3-4K range you can find a bass you don't have to fight. There is no fault to be found in that big sound you pull out of that bass, but you also are not going to get it for under 4K on the used market on a lucky day! So, money equals sound to a point.
Another point to make is that hybrid and carved basses really do open up over the years and as they are played. My bass is not even close to the bass I bought in the early 90s. It is far more resonant and open. Even my travel bass is way different than when I got it several years ago.
What am I missing?
I have a great interest in Basses and regularly read reviews and forums etc.
There are several Pollmann's for sale on various websites; among other basses.
For the other basses in the same price range, the sound is described as impressive in various ways.
With the Pollmann's all I read is: "Well built", "Beautiful", "Solid" etc, but never any comment on the sound. Certainly no Wow factor.
Does the sound quality or projection of a Pollmann compare favourably with similar priced basses?
As far as I am aware Pollmann once entered the ISB competition with their Venezia model and won a prize for tone.
I have a great interest in Basses and regularly read reviews and forums etc.
There are several Pollmann's for sale on various websites; among other basses.
For the other basses in the same price range, the sound is described as impressive in various ways.
With the Pollmann's all I read is: "Well built", "Beautiful", "Solid" etc, but never any comment on the sound. Certainly no Wow factor.
Does the sound quality or projection of a Pollmann compare favourably with similar priced basses?
As far as I am aware Pollmann once entered the ISB competition with their Venezia model and won a prize for tone.
Mona, your inquiry highlights the fundamental difference between double-bass luthiery and retail guitar manufacturing.
Guitars are products. They are, and always have been, built in factories. They vary considerably -- there is a bell-curve -- but when you buy an Epiphone Les Paul you know a lot about what's going to come out of the box. You know so much that an entire consumer industry is based on the proposition that you, the buyer, don't need to do anything more than look at pictures before you buy. People who buy guitars generally fall in lust with a picture, a spec, a crappy hyper-compressed YouTube vid and a memory of somebody else's guitar.
DBs are giant things, so big that the actual plates of wood differ. Although many aspects of the models are fixed or constrained there is a lot of room for subtle variation in shape and size. Different setups affect the feel and sound of individual instruements noticeably. Then throw in what happens to the bass for years and it's just wide-open. It's no exaggeration to say that "the same" brand and model bass, set up to the same measurements, with different histories and different strings will work and sound very differently.
The entire notion of "Shens blah blah" or "Pollmanns thumpty bumpty" is guitar-talk, the language of fungibility, of interchangeable-ness. It's advertising bull-product.
I've played some Pollmanns over the years. Without exception they have been "Well built", "Beautiful" and "Solid." (I recall not a single liquid Pollmann product. Truth in advertising, but read carefully!) One or two had "wow factor." Some sounded like crates -- choked and thumpy. Their price reflected the nice ones and the Ron Carter Factor, which is to say, they were priced based on fungibility but did not have the benefit of actual fungibility.
a) Some are great-sounding basses. From your description yours is one of those!
b) Not all luthiery competitions are run with screens. The Pollmann Venezia model has a carved rosette and funky f-holes which are clearly identifiable at a distance.
c) That bass is the topic of this 2005 TB/DB thread and it did apparently sound great. The proud owner, Peter Feretti, talked about running the rack at Lemur and how that particular instrument stood out by a mile from the other Pollmann basses.
Enjoy your Pollmann and keep massaging their toes!
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Not true, he has a carved one, the first one, because he did not want a ply bass. Also, what a pro can pull a sound from has zero to do with what is going to serve as a main bass for a normal bassist.
And LEGENDS can get a great sound out of head of cabbage…
Thanks for that Sam, a lot of info there, and yes, there's no substitute to trying and playing each bass before you buy it, unless of course, you commission a new bass. In that case, you will try similar basses from your luthier of choice. The Luthier you choose will be based on research and reputation, and then trust them to build you a great bass. That's what I did and I am happy.
I am also aware that some luthiers may build consignments of basses for say an Orchestra or music school along with private commissions or basses to enter into competitions, and this may be an area where quality varies.
I do find it interesting, though, how different builders do seem to achieve different results, resulting in different pricing. I am very interested in this and hope to sample many more basses to compare and contrast.
As you pointed out, there seems to be quite a bit of variation in Pollmann basses, while I have herd that Tom Martin basses are quite consistent and similar. New Nick Lloyd basses seem to sell for quite a lot. Horst Gruenert Basses seem to be highly regarded. And of course, there is the string issue! I don't know how people can even start to compare basses with different strings, but I suppose an experienced connoisseur can pick out innate quality traits from the bass itself.
I know absolutely nothing about bass guitars and currently have no interest in them; but since I first started browsing this site many years ago, it seems there a lot more guys posting here who are familiar with both.
Please keep sharing you experience of different types of bass!! All very interesting!
I have never had an expensive bass or guitar, but I have had other very expensive toys, were they worth the extra money? To me they were very much worth it.
I was less concerned about certain performance aspects, and more into an admiration of fine craftsmanship, and use of best quality materials, made by an artisan's hand. That $200 Casio G-Shock keeps better time and has more functions than the finest mechanical Swiss watches, but it won't give you that sense of artistic wonder when it operates.
I was less concerned about certain performance aspects, and more into an admiration of fine craftsmanship, and use of best quality materials, made by an artisan's hand. That $200 Casio G-Shock keeps better time and has more functions than the finest mechanical Swiss watches, but it won't give you that sense of artistic wonder when it operates.
Doing some string research for a bass I just got and need to get setup. I listened to alot of the recordings of different strings from some person’s website, so I assume it’s the same bass. One thing that stood out to me was every sound clip still sounded like the same bass, strings make a difference but the instrument is still the instrument.
When I attended college Pollmann student line basses, held a similar place in the market to what Shen basses do today, but that was 30+ years ago. As those basses have aged, many of them become exceptional instruments with great sound. There were also master built instruments that the senior luthiers
in the Pollmann family built on commission for individual bassists Murray Grodiner had a beautiful Gamba shaped Pollmann that was his solo instrument.
in the Pollmann family built on commission for individual bassists Murray Grodiner had a beautiful Gamba shaped Pollmann that was his solo instrument.
There is beautiful Pollmann with an incredible tone and power to spare that is worth visiting at STL Strings right now. 18K. Hogtown Smokehouse is solid if you haven't been, as well!
interestingly, $6k in 2005 works out to $9.2k today. not of extreme relevance, but nonetheless interesting.
I had several ply/laminated basses, a Hoffner and a Wilhelm Eberle, and played quite a few Kay/Englehards as well. They are fine for learning, but will never have the sound of a carved bass, or even a Hybrid with laminated back/sides and carved top. Hybrids are great when it comes to a compromise between cost, durability, and sound quality. But, even hybrids are relatively pricey compared to all laminated basses and for the money, a good sounding but used solid carved bass is a better investment if you are after the best sound. Many here have said they have a carved bass and a laminated bass, the idea being to use the laminated bass for gigs, but in practice, most of us can't resist using the carved bass, and the laminated bass sits neglected!
I'm guessing like guitars, no two basses of the same make and model are equal, and there are good ones, and exceptional ones, and dogs too. The set-up on basses is very critical to their play-ability and sound; so even a "good" bass can sound and play poorly if it is out of adjustment. This is where an good Luthier is invaluable.
I'm guessing like guitars, no two basses of the same make and model are equal, and there are good ones, and exceptional ones, and dogs too. The set-up on basses is very critical to their play-ability and sound; so even a "good" bass can sound and play poorly if it is out of adjustment. This is where an good Luthier is invaluable.
That is true and funny.I and the one other bass player in the audience will notice Kungfu's 10-20%; they will be the one person who chats it up with me during the set break.
If I bring my polished ALCOA, 50 people will rabidly mob me at the break, and not one of them will mention "tone".
I could drop $100,000 on a 250 year old fragile brown wooden bass from the land of my ancestors and it will still likely sound like me +10%.
The audience will still spend the entire night watching the attractive woman at the front of the stage who sings and plays a $600 guitar and not give a $#!t about the guy on stage left playing the big "chello"....
Reminds me of when I was talking to a pro recently, and asked him about the value "ornaments and variations" played in a basic 1/5 bluegrass bass pattern. He said (paraphrased) everyone depends on the bass, but no one listens to it. Not the people in your band, and definitely not the audience. The one guy who is paying attention to you is standing in the back, staring at you, with his arms crossed over his chest. He's the only other bass player in the room - and probably didn't even pay the cover charge!
Haha! People in my bands always tell me “I only listen to the bass!”Reminds me of when I was talking to a pro recently, and asked him about the value "ornaments and variations" played in a basic 1/5 bluegrass bass pattern. He said (paraphrased) everyone depends on the bass, but no one listens to it. Not the people in your band, and definitely not the audience. The one guy who is paying attention to you is standing in the back, staring at you, with his arms crossed over his chest. He's the only other bass player in the room - and probably didn't even pay the cover charge!