Agree. Also, blaming the Suez Canal, or COVID for the lack of repair parts is a red herring. I was told Costco requires suppliers of appliances etc., to support those products for 7 years or they won’t sell them.
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Agree. Also, blaming the Suez Canal, or COVID for the lack of repair parts is a red herring. I was told Costco requires suppliers of appliances etc., to support those products for 7 years or they won’t sell them.
I have a pair of K10.2's as part of a small PA I use from time to time. I definitely tried the K10.2 in a stage monitor config. Like the OP, I'm also running a Noble (Cali76 => VT => Noble) and while it worked ok, I much prefer that same signal chain into a Mesa WD800 and Berg CN112 on a tilt back stand. The WD800/Berg rig is just as easy of a schlep, its oriented like a monitor due to the tilt back stand, and it just sounds way more like a bass amp to me (because of course, it is 
). Of course this is comparing a 2way 10" + tweeter to a 12" +tweeter so maybe not an entirely fair compare.
I do get how the QSC can work ok as a monitor, but I find them kind of "dry" sounding compared to an actual bass rig.
). Of course this is comparing a 2way 10" + tweeter to a 12" +tweeter so maybe not an entirely fair compare. I do get how the QSC can work ok as a monitor, but I find them kind of "dry" sounding compared to an actual bass rig.
The only downside I’ve encountered is if you seek to play a sub octave pedal at high SPLs, as in moving lots of air in the 20-60hz region, it will fart. “Normal” bass hasn’t been an issue, only heavily exaggerated lows.
I used a powered speaker as a bass amp for live gigs for a while because I wanted to be able to hear/adjust the tone as it sounded out of a PA rather than a 'bass amp'. One downside I encountered is that if anything failed the whole thing was down, same way a combo amp would be. However, getting repairs for a powered speaker are quite a bit more difficult than for a bass amp. The market moves on and replacement parts for older models are not plentiful.
I've had the opportunity to mix on a QSC Isis systems a couple of times a year and have never had a problem with it. I've also run into under-sized systems from all manufacturers that are, simply put, not enough rig for the gig. Those are the nights you just want to be over.
Mad respect for Phil as a player, but his Scott's BL content is awful. Way too fast, with little written support to study.
His written contributions, to Bass Mag, etc... are much better,
My Peavey Mini Mega that may be on it's last leg. It made a frying sound at my last gig... though when I tested it the next day in the garage it seemed to work fine. I'm not sure if I can trust it. I was thinking about going in the ampless direction.
Question: Would a Line 6 HD500 work as the preamp in this type of setup? I have one I don't use but haven't sold it because I'd like to use it one of these days.
Question: Would a Line 6 HD500 work as the preamp in this type of setup? I have one I don't use but haven't sold it because I'd like to use it one of these days.
I agree that it works with good FOH.
Pound for pound, high quality, lightweight bass amps are hard to beat. Powered PA speakers sound great, but are not designed to function as bass amps.
I’ll carry my Markbass 112 combo over a 112 PA cab. Add an external speaker to the combo and I can play pretty loud with no FOH support.
Everyone should try out some powered PA cabs. Many are excellent!
For K series, read the app guide. It points out:
" Input A again can be mic or line level, but Input B now can be either a line level input or a high-Z one suitable for musical instruments that have passive magnetic or piezo pickups. That’s right—the K.2 Series loudspeakers can be used as guitar or bass combo amp, and they won’t load down the instrument like a regular mic or line input would."
Pedals before the amp are more of a high-Z than they are a line level.
Powered Cabs with DSP have many EQ options.
And they all handle IRs so they can resonate like a bass cab can.
For K series, read the app guide. It points out:
" Input A again can be mic or line level, but Input B now can be either a line level input or a high-Z one suitable for musical instruments that have passive magnetic or piezo pickups. That’s right—the K.2 Series loudspeakers can be used as guitar or bass combo amp, and they won’t load down the instrument like a regular mic or line input would."
Pedals before the amp are more of a high-Z than they are a line level.
Powered Cabs with DSP have many EQ options.
And they all handle IRs so they can resonate like a bass cab can.
Take the Ampeg SVT 610 cab here:
Power 1000w peak, 465w RMS.
Maximum SPL 129 dB.
Frequency response 55 Hz to 20 kHz at 10 dB below rated sensitivity.
Nominal coverage angle is 90°
The low end difference is that the ampeg is at 42Hz at -10db and the yamaha is at 55Hz at -10db, and ampeg is 53hz at -3db when the yamaha is around 67hz at -3db, but the max spl is in favor of the Yamaha actually, wich mean it is louder with slightly less low end (13Hz at -10db and 14Hz at -3db), does that really matter with all the HPF people use?
So the question is, do anyone think that a combo is better at pushing the low end than the mighty SVT 610 fridge?
(I supressed the previous post because I found those info who are actually what decided me to go the Monitor way).
- Speaker & wattage information: 6x10" & 600W
- Frequency Response (-3dB): 53Hz-18kHz
- Usable Low Frequency (-10dB): 42Hz
- Sensitivity: 98dB
- Maximum SPL: 125dB
Power 1000w peak, 465w RMS.
Maximum SPL 129 dB.
Frequency response 55 Hz to 20 kHz at 10 dB below rated sensitivity.
Nominal coverage angle is 90°
The low end difference is that the ampeg is at 42Hz at -10db and the yamaha is at 55Hz at -10db, and ampeg is 53hz at -3db when the yamaha is around 67hz at -3db, but the max spl is in favor of the Yamaha actually, wich mean it is louder with slightly less low end (13Hz at -10db and 14Hz at -3db), does that really matter with all the HPF people use?
So the question is, do anyone think that a combo is better at pushing the low end than the mighty SVT 610 fridge?
(I supressed the previous post because I found those info who are actually what decided me to go the Monitor way).
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Yes, it's for this kind of set-up that so many guitarists and bassists are going down the PA speaker "FRFR" route. Many of us have struggled over the years to get the sound of our amp in the FOH speakers, especially if it's integral part of your tone.
This route takes the physical amp out of the equation and relies on modelling or a preamp. The sound you get on stage from your personal PA speaker should be very close to what comes out of the FOH. It also means you can turn up and any gig where FOH and monitoring are provided and get your sound consistently.
Just wait until you ditch the on-stage speaker totally and go IEM. It's a revelation.
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A couple of important details however. You will discover that the max SPL numbers are not directly comparable since Yamaha uses the peak power for the calculation and the Ampeg cabinet used RMS power. Deduct 3dB from the powered speaker and the numbers will be more comparable.
There is also additional processing within the powered speaker that is used to get that effective power handling with reliability, that limiting reduces the SPL at low frequencies under high drive conditions.
IME, the 610 will be perceived to sound “bigger”, louder and more dynamic, especially when driven hard.
I never liked the 610 but I toured with an 810 fridge for years. I love them. Nowadays I carry a k12.2 when I need an amp. Sounds great. But it doesn't hold a candle to a fridge. But it's all I need.
I know that this comparison have limitations, it is comparing a 610 to a 112 (+ coax twitter) after all. But it show what my thinking is about, a good PA system or floor monitor will be sufficient to be used as a regular bass amp combo, because I doubt that any single speaker bass combo will be capable of being resonably close in term of frequency response to a SVT 610 where my monitor...well...can.
The drive thing is limited only by how good your preamp and IR is soundwise, but not volumewise, because what kind of bar, or small space, will allow a full Ampeg SVT anyway (wich, if driven hard, is...LOUD AS HELL, but good
) wich is the only kind of place where I need an amp situation.
That sounds like a pretty great little setup for my bar gigs. Thank you for the response!
I know that this comparison have limitations, it is comparing a 610 to a 112 (+ coax twitter) after all. But it show what my thinking is about, a good PA system or floor monitor will be sufficient to be used as a regular bass amp combo, because I doubt that any single speaker bass combo will be capable of being resonably close in term of frequency response to a SVT 610 where my monitor...well...can.
The drive thing is limited only by how good your preamp and IR is soundwise, but not volumewise, because what kind of bar, or small space, will allow a full Ampeg SVT anyway (wich, if driven hard, is...LOUD AS HELL, but good
Eeehhhhhh.... I don't know well enough to know exactly the frequency response of the speaker in comparison to others. What I can tell you is that my k12.2 pretty much holds up about as well as my Aguilar Tone Hammer and DB 112 did. The DB felt a little fuller on the bottom end but overall both were pretty comparable. When running two DB112s though, they would outperform the k12.2 on bass. Most 412, 410, & 810s I've played would outdo the 112s as well. That said, my tone hammer and DB112S are gone, as is my SWR 12 Stack, as is my SVT810E, and their respective heads. K12.2 is still in my house though. My powered speaker is definitely sufficient and much more versatile in varied use than of them were.